Weight Loss Support - More thoughts on "naturally thin"




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freelancemomma
04-29-2013, 09:33 PM
I've been doing some reading on the "naturally thin" phenomenon. It's a complex and confusing area. Research suggests that variations in weight stem from:
Variations in energy intake (biggest factor)
Variations in appetite and perceptions of hunger/fullness (which may be partly genetic)
Variations in basal metabolic rate (certainly a factor, but less pronounced than commonly supposed)
Variations in metabolic adaptation to caloric excess or restriction.

I came across the following post, which I found quite illuminating as it supports something I've always believed. (I realize it's only one example, but I suspect it's not unusual and I've certainly observed it in some of my friends.)

<<I am a "naturally thin" woman. For years I could not gain any weight no matter how much I ate. That is what I used to think until I actually measured my calories intake. Last summer I kept a diary of what I ate. I religiously weighted every piece of food that got into my mouth, meals and snacks, everything. And then I took daily average. And you know what? Turns out I didn't eat enough. For my height of 1.73m I ate only 1500 kcal a day. Turns out that a huge pizza for dinner barely compensates for skipped and forgotten breakfast. And turns out that a big bowl of squid salad is not so nourishing, even if seasoned with mayonnaise. That was such a surprise. It just shows how much someone's perception can differ from reality. I really did believe that I consumed a lot.>>

Freelance


shcirerf
04-29-2013, 10:48 PM
Over the last few years, I've spent a lot of time, while grocery shopping, at work, at the gym, just out in public in general, watching people, and if they are skinny or heavy. What's in the cart and so on and so forth in mind.

There does not really seem to be any rhyme or reason to any of it.

One, "naturally thin" lady, always has a cart full of crap. I suspect, it's for the family, and she rarely indulges in any of it and she's one of those always on the move people!

My terribly over weight neighbor also has a cart full of junk, it's' obvious, she eats it!

My grocery cart is an odd mix. My stuff, stuff for the DH. It would make most peoples heads spin!

I really don't think that anyone is "naturally thin", they just eat less, and move more, without actually realizing what they are doing.

SeeMyFeet
04-29-2013, 11:12 PM
Are you guys thinking too much??

Hey...here's another part to that equation:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/28/health/studies-focus-on-gut-bacteria-in-weight-loss.html?_r=0

fecal transplants. less expensive than gastric bypass. (just the thought of it instantly kills my appetite!)


alaskanlaughter
04-29-2013, 11:31 PM
Interesting reads....Ive always wondered about the connection between gut microbes and weight...Especially after having 5 rounds of harsh antibiotics last year for a massive ear infection.

Ronja
04-30-2013, 07:40 AM
Interesting thoughts!

I have a "naturally thin" husband. I've always felt it unfair me and him both would have a chocolate bar after dinner every day, and I would gain weight, he wouldn't. I always blamed it on different metabolism and considered myself unlucky in this aspect.

But, couple of years ago, I finally faced the truth. It's not about my or his metabilism, it's about the way we eat. The major difference between my and his way of eating is the perception of hunger, and reaction on it. He eats when he's hungry. He doesn't stop until the hunger is over. When it's over, he doesn't eat anymore. I eat when it seems "appropriate" (even though I might not be hungry at all), and if I like the food, I'll eat much more than I need to statisfy hunger.

When we come home after a day out, I will have a dinner, no matter if we have eaten out or not. Coming home = dinner to me. And I will grab something and put it in my mouth before even undressing. Even though I'm NOT hungry. He doesn't do that. Often he says he is full, and doesn't eat anything, or eats very little. If he eats, he prepares his plate carefuly, sits down, eats, finishes eating and does something else. I would grab this and that, try a little of this, little of that, perhaps have a plate of something, and a little extra helping, perhaps something sweet to finish it off. I nibble a lot, and I bet if I ever had to put everything I nibbled on on a plate, I would be shocked to see the size of the portion.

So, yeah. Not a metabolism in my case, certainly not. I comfort myself by food, I cheer up myself by food, I love food, and that's it.

Vex
04-30-2013, 08:01 AM
I tend to also believe people who have remained at a healthy weight have different mindsets concerning food, whether realized or unrealized. I wouldn't be surprised at all if some of that is genetic.

SouthernMaven
04-30-2013, 08:43 AM
He eats when he's hungry. He doesn't stop until the hunger is over. When it's over, he doesn't eat anymore.

Ronja - your husband is a classic example of an intuitive eater. I was exactly the same way for 20 years (age 28-48) and never had a weight problem. Now I've decided to return to that WOE. I've not been perfect at it, but pretty good - even if I have to say so myself. (I just did!) ;)

A bit OT, but I believe you are in the Czech Republic, right? I wanted to say I was so sorry to hear about the explosion in Prague. I was in Prague two years ago this month and loved everything about it. We also made a side trip to Kutna Hora.

Beautiful country, beautiful people. I'd love to go back.

leighalittletyke
04-30-2013, 08:44 AM
My BF is like that. He's comparable to a black hole except he doesn't get any bigger. He's 6'1"and weighs less than I do! like, seriously? All he does all day is sit on his computer working and playing video games while I'm downstairs sweating my chubby butt off exercising. he also has ADHD though so that might contribute to him being so skinny. If he doesn't have his meds he moves a million miles a minute. I also suspect he has a thyroid problem but won't get it tested.

Ronja
04-30-2013, 08:55 AM
I tend to also believe people who have remained at a healthy weight have different mindsets concerning food, whether realized or unrealized. I wouldn't be surprised at all if some of that is genetic.

You know, this got me thinking. The perception of hunger and ability to stop when having eaten enough may actually have some connection with genes. Just on the top of my head, I can see 3 examples in my life:

1. Myself - I have, as far as I remember, always ate too much, especially sweets. When I was like 8, we had a little Christmas celebration at school. Everyone brought some sweets and candies, and I remember my skinny schoolmate asking me why I am eating so much sweets, she said "you don't have to eat all of it, you know?" I remember I just couldn't figure out why everyone else is not eating it, it was obviously good!!! Also, in school cafeteria, I was always worried they would give me a small portion...it was my every worry, before lunch, whether or not they'll give me full plate. So even at early age, my mind was very occuppied by food.

2. My twin daughters: I really watch very closely what they eat, as I don't want them to struggle with weight they way I do. But I can already see how different they are, aged only 2, when it comes to eating. My daughter A took after me. She won't finish her dinner, but when she has a chance to eat something sweet (rarely, but sometimes the opportunity occurs), she will eat LOTS of it. Even though she's not hungry, just because she likes the taste. She will also eat considerably more of food she likes than food she doesn't particularly care about.

My daughter B took after my husband. She eats pretty much everything when she's hungry. When she's not hungry, she won't eat, whatever food is being offered to her. She might be sometimes tempted by a candie, but just eats a little bit of it. She won't eat it if she's full, even though she likes the taste. She shows much healthier approach to food already. The difference between two of them is striking.

3. MY friend's daughter: she's two, and she is extremly fat. She weights as much as a healthy 4 year old, in fact. She would not stop eating. And the most shocking part, to me, is that she's ALWAYS been like that. She was born a normal weight, but she soon gained a lot while being breastfed. She would suck her milk, and never stop until her mother unlatched her. (my girls always stopped nursing when they were full). Later as she was weaned off, she showed pretty much the same approach to any food. She just wants it!!! When she sees anything that resembles food, she'll go "nom, nom" and do anything she can to get her hands on it. Her mother tries to offer her fruits and vegetable (she eats it, she eats everytihng) but with this enormous apetite it's difficult to control her weight. Her mother says she's not concerend very much, as she had been a very fat child herself (she is a normal weight now).

So this all is just falling at the place now, and I'm starting to believe there's something inherently genetic about the way we deal with hunger, and how we approach eating. Interesting!

Tuscany
04-30-2013, 08:56 AM
I agree that mindset towards food is a large part of the equation. I think the mindset also depends on upbringing. If your parents or others used food to reward or comfort you when you were growing up (giving you a chocolate bar for being good, making your favorite dinner when you needed cheering up, etc.), then I suspect you're likely to comfort/reward yourself using food later in life. Others who haven't learned to associate food with comfort/reward tend to eat if and when they're hungry, not otherwise.

Wannabeskinny
04-30-2013, 08:56 AM
I have a naturally thin husband and a naturally thin mother. So I've been able to observe quite closely how they eat. There are times they over indulge, just like anyone. However, they make up for it later by not eating anything later and having very light meals the next day. It's like normal people at Thanksgiving - they stuff themselves and then they say "I won't be eating for days" and then they literally hardly eat anything the next day! Not me, everyday is Thanksgiving. One big meal does not affect my ability to eat a big meal later in the day or the next day. It's this sense of balance that keeps people natural.

Another thing that I've noticed in thin people is their reaction to hunger. They don't seem upset by it. My husband can be hungry but wait for dinner, my mother can skip a whole meal if you ask her to. Both can go to bed without dinner and not have any sense of deprivation. For me I react to hunger differently, and that's what I'm trying to change. I don't want to be consumed by hunger, which often brings out anger in me.

CherryPie99
04-30-2013, 09:05 AM
I was never one to blame my fatness on a slow metabolism. I was fat because I ate wayyyyy too much and didn't exercise.

HOWEVER, I do believe that certain people have metabolic advantages that allow them to eat more and stay thin. My sister-in-law is one of these. She seriously eats like she is afraid that people are going to come and steal food off her plate and is thin.

Her sister is positively scrawny. I haven't spent enough time around the sister to know how she eats on a normal basis, but when I have seen her eat it appears to be a "normal" amount of food.

Jen

luckymommy
04-30-2013, 09:25 AM
I think some people (who struggle with weight) are born with a built in very high appetite and some people develop it later in life. My husband struggles with his weight. When he was a baby, he would eat three times as much as a typical baby. He rarely feels full so is constantly feeling deprived and eventually, he gives in and binges.

I, on the other hand, was a typical baby. I had an appetite that made my parents very happy (they felt babies should be chunky) but as I was a child growing up, I was thin. Around puberty, all that changed and I started to struggle with weight. The binge eating began when I was 19 though probably due to some traumatic events.

I also read that once someone is obese, they no longer derive the same pleasure from food as thin people so we need more and more of that food to get the same effect. I completely get that because this entire past year (when I gained 50 lbs.), I don't think I enjoyed my food very much. Now that I'm eating on track, I'm starting to enjoy it a lot more.

SeeMyFeet
04-30-2013, 11:41 PM
oooooh...you ladies are still thinkin' !!

Here's som'thin' else to think about:
http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/why-eating-slowly-may-help-you-feel-full-faster-20101019605

There are genes for neuropeptide/digestive hormones that affect satiety. I would bet my "defect" is in something like neuropeptide S--affects anxiety and appetite. I live with a constant anxious feeling in the solar plexus, can lead to "mindless" eating.

NATURE didn't make that cow that could produce 1000gal of milk per udder--selective breeding did. Combining all those minor milk-producing variations together into one animal sure created a weird beast! I'm guessing my ancestors survived the WORST famines and passed a lovely collection of efficient-metabolism traits down to me!

freelancemomma
05-01-2013, 07:18 AM
I'm starting to believe there's something inherently genetic about the way we deal with hunger, and how we approach eating. Interesting!

I agree. My mom told me that as an infant I would insist on having exactly twice as many bottles of formula as the doctor recommended. After each feeding I would raise h-e-l-l until I got that second bottle.

And like you, I've had a long history of eating "just because." How I envy those people who intuitively push away their plates when they've had "enough," whatever that is!

Freelance

elvislover324
05-01-2013, 08:24 AM
I too wonder if it's something hardwired or genetic vs. a learned behavior.

Before I started my current diet, my life revolved around food (I'd be thinking about what I was going to eat for lunch and/or dinner before I was done eating my breakfast). My husband isn't like that nor does he understand it. He can be at work at his office or working outside on the weekend and "forget" to stop for lunch. I have NEVER forgot to eat one meal in my life!

I also find that at least half (maybe more) of the "naturally thin" people I knew growing up (I'm 37 now) are no longer the thin people they were. Of course I will never know if it's diet or activity changes but I will assume both of those things contributed (more and/or poor food choices and decline in exercise time) and maybe they were never naturally thin in the first place. I was jealous thinking they were thin because it was God's gift to them but they actually worked their tails off to be that way.

Just a little O/T, yesterday I ran into the Avenue store since I don't live near one and I passed one in my travels. I was looking through the 14s and noticed a lady looking at me (I'm paranoid) while she was looking through the 28s. I'll never know what she was thinking but I wanted to tell her, I was a size 28 less than 9 months ago. I know what it feels like to be in that section. Obviously I'll never know what was on her mind but I did wonder if she thought I was "naturally a 14" and if she only knew how hard I had to work to get here!!

Sorry for rambling. Love this thread.

Rana
05-01-2013, 09:46 AM
I think there might be a genetic component and a physical one.

I also think it's about habit and how we comfortable we are with being uncomfortable.

In the case of the husband and MIL who are fine going to bed without dinner -- that's something that I'm working on.

I'm clearly not going to starve if I miss lunch one day or I get home so late I might as well just eat a piece of fruit and go to bed. I'm still overweight!

And I am working on being comfortable with that. Yes, it's a habit that I have to eat three meals and snacks during the day, but that isn't working for me anymore. I was getting pretty comfortable with three meals a day with no snacks and that's an easier way to stay within my calories.

But that's psychological and individual -- can you be comfortable letting hunger exist in your stomach for an hour until dinner is ready? Sometimes I can be, sometimes I can't be (I have to watch it for myself because of blood sugar issues).

Mountain Mamma
05-01-2013, 10:15 AM
I agree. My mom told me that as an infant I would insist on having exactly twice as many bottles of formula as the doctor recommended. After each feeding I would raise h-e-l-l until I got that second bottle.

Freelance

Well, Freelance Momma, given your height, maybe that doctor didn't know how statuesque you were to become and was just plain wrong about how much formula you needed!! !:hun: :hun:

Amarantha2
05-01-2013, 06:36 PM
I don't really think there is such a thing as naturally thin or naturally heavy. Unless affected by a medical condition, folk are the weight they are as a result of physics, more or less, energy in/energy out, with some factors such as the type of food, habits & food personality factored in.

Just my opinion. :)

ReillyJ
05-01-2013, 06:53 PM
And like you, I've had a long history of eating "just because." How I envy those people who intuitively push away their plates when they've had "enough," whatever that is!

Freelance

Me, too. I have found out after losing 100 lbs and changing my eating habits to obtain that goal, that i have a very strong appetite and can eat great quantities of food. I simply am hungry often and it takes a lot for me to be satisfied, unlike my "naturally" slender friend who is able to eat very little and have it satisfy her. She also has very strong taste buds and if she doesn't love the food, she doesn't eat it. i only WISH i had even a normal appetite and that i was satisfied easily and that food didn't interest me that much!

Tibbits2u
05-01-2013, 06:59 PM
I have a cousin who is naturally thin. she is 5'5 and weighs around 110 pounds and never seems to gain weight at all. she never watches what she eats or makes healthy choices. last week i saw her polish down a whole medium sized pepperoni pizza, breadsticks with a 2 liter of coke ! she eats likes this pretty regularly at least 7 or 8 times a week. her blood work is terrible, she is "skinny fat" with high cholestrol and stuff but her weight never changes ! she's like a black hole or something !

freelancemomma
05-01-2013, 07:24 PM
It's like normal people at Thanksgiving - they stuff themselves and then they say "I won't be eating for days" and then they literally hardly eat anything the next day! Not me, everyday is Thanksgiving. One big meal does not affect my ability to eat a big meal later in the day or the next day.

I'm just the same. Your post reminded me of an early January restaurant dinner hosted by a skinny friend of mine. When we all sat down at the table (about 8 women), she announced, "I don't know about anyone else, but just the thought of food makes me gag right now, after all the Christmas parties." Unfortunately I didn't share her sentiments.

F.

Wannabeskinny
05-01-2013, 08:01 PM
...I've had a long history of eating "just because." How I envy those people who intuitively push away their plates when they've had "enough," whatever that is!

Freelance

You know what, I find that I am able to sense "enough" when I'm out with friends eating dinner and enjoying the conversation. Somehow the company and the atmosphere keep my focus off the food which makes me eat slower and allows my body to read the signals of having had enough. I can't same the same of when I eat alone though, I'm a completely different eater when I'm by myself. I eat more, I watch tv but it doesn't distract me in the same way that good company does. I wonder if there's something to that.

lin43
05-01-2013, 08:17 PM
I also read that once someone is obese, they no longer derive the same pleasure from food as thin people so we need more and more of that food to get the same effect. I completely get that because this entire past year (when I gained 50 lbs.), I don't think I enjoyed my food very much. Now that I'm eating on track, I'm starting to enjoy it a lot more.

This is really interesting. I have often felt that my taste buds are not as tuned into flavors as my husband (who has never had a weight problem). Thus, to really get the complete flavor of a food, I tend to want to eat it to excess, eat it fast (so the taste is constantly in my mouth during the meal), and eat big bites of it. I'm not saying that I like frozen dinners or anything like that; I've trained my palate over the years to enjoy better food (I'm somewhat of a "foodie"), but I think it's "training" rather than "natural." My husband has great taste buds; he can usually detect flavors in foods that I cannot (unless he points it out to me). I've often conjectured that he is satisfied with less food because he can truly taste everything he eats.

lin43
05-01-2013, 08:20 PM
I agree. My mom told me that as an infant I would insist on having exactly twice as many bottles of formula as the doctor recommended. After each feeding I would raise h-e-l-l until I got that second bottle.

Me, too! My mother told me that when my bottle was finished I would scream bloody murder until I got more. She even described me throwing my bottle out of the crib as if to say, "Done with that---where's the rest?"

lin43
05-01-2013, 08:31 PM
I think there might be a genetic component and a physical one.

I also think it's about habit and how we comfortable we are with being uncomfortable.

In the case of the husband and MIL who are fine going to bed without dinner -- that's something that I'm working on.

I'm clearly not going to starve if I miss lunch one day or I get home so late I might as well just eat a piece of fruit and go to bed. I'm still overweight!

And I am working on being comfortable with that. Yes, it's a habit that I have to eat three meals and snacks during the day, but that isn't working for me anymore. I was getting pretty comfortable with three meals a day with no snacks and that's an easier way to stay within my calories.

But that's psychological and individual -- can you be comfortable letting hunger exist in your stomach for an hour until dinner is ready? Sometimes I can be, sometimes I can't be (I have to watch it for myself because of blood sugar issues).

Sorry for the serial posts, but as I keep reading this thread, I keep seeing these great responses that I just must comment on. Rana, ITA with your comment about "how we comfortable we are with being uncomfortable." If I'm not busy and I'm hungry, it's almost as if every part of my being screams, "I MUST EAT NOW!" My husband, however, rarely eats lunch, no matter how small of a breakfast he has had. I sometimes ask him, "But aren't you hungry?" He'll say, "Yes, but hunger is just a feeling" and shrugs it off. Obviously, he is more comfortable with the feeling of hunger than I am.
When I am busy, though (at work, for instance), I can ignore the hunger MUCH more easily. Today, I purposely just brought a tangelo for lunch. During my afternoon class, I did feel hunger pains, but it was a given that I could not eat anything, so I ignored my hunger, and forgot about it. When I got home, I was hungry for my dinner, and it felt really good.

The thing is, I really love being hungry for meals; it makes everything taste so much better. However, when I'm "in the moment" and have access to food, it's so difficult to ignore the feeling. Also, there is a fine line between hunger that I can manage (like the type I experienced today) and hunger that drives me to eat everything in sight. Sometimes, I cannot tell the difference before it is too late.

ETA: You know what, I find that I am able to sense "enough" when I'm out with friends eating dinner and enjoying the conversation. Somehow the company and the atmosphere keep my focus off the food which makes me eat slower and allows my body to read the signals of having had enough. I can't same the same of when I eat alone though, I'm a completely different eater when I'm by myself. I eat more, I watch tv but it doesn't distract me in the same way that good company does. I wonder if there's something to that.

I'm exactly the same. Also, I think the spacing of the food (all that time between courses) helps me to tune in more to my feelings of fullness. I eat too fast, and that problem is worse at home when I don't have anyone spacing out the food for me.

Rana
05-01-2013, 09:18 PM
S
The thing is, I really love being hungry for meals; it makes everything taste so much better. However, when I'm "in the moment" and have access to food, it's so difficult to ignore the feeling.


ME TOO. When I'm home, it's much harder, because I have easily accessible food. Even if it's "healthy" food like fruit, vegs, nuts (because I don't buy any processed/junk food).

But I'll still eat.

When I'm in a situation -- like your class -- where I don't have access to food, I can ignore it and be comfortable with being hungry.

Elladorine
05-01-2013, 11:20 PM
Reading through this thread immediately made me think of a realization I had a few years back when eating at a family function. One of my SIL's took a bite or two of some pie, remarked how yummy it was, but went on to say that it was way too sweet for her to stomach. And I thought, "Man! What I wouldn't give for sweets to be too sweet for me!" :dizzy:

Even when I was a little grade-schooler without a weight problem, I was sneaking whole spoons out of the sugar bowl and could eat gobs of frosting out of a can or cake batter out of a bowl like it was ice cream. It was no wonder that I did have a weight problem by the time I was in junior high, but my mother was adamant to blame it on the steroids prescribed by my newly-developed asthma. And I spent years and years feeling like the victim of a set of bad circumstances since I'd also believed that my weight issues had been directly tied to becoming asthmatic. Looking back, I now know that although it was likely a catalyst (or even an effect of my eating), it was much more complicated than that.

I've had severe GAD for years, and unbeknownst to me, I'd often eat out of anxiety. I'm also a comfort eater, and just an eater period, I guess. I especially like sweet, crunchy, and creamy food. I'd eventually reached a point of desensitization, needing more and more while enjoying it less and less, just like a drug addict. For years and years I couldn't even enjoy plain fruit, my taste buds were so hooked on sugar that oranges and strawberries were as sour as lemons to me (so of course, I'd have to pour sugar on them). And while I've mostly broken the cycle by giving up deep-fried foods and most added sugar, I know I could relapse at any time.

I still envy my SIL for being able to say sweets are too sweet for her; I doubt I'll ever reach that point. But if I stay adamant and vigilant about my eating plan by tracking my food, I'm hoping to stay on top of things. I wish I could just be an intuitive eater, but at least I'm taking control now.

veggiedaze
05-01-2013, 11:20 PM
Really interesting discussion going on here!

Lecomtes
05-02-2013, 12:02 AM
You know what, I find that I am able to sense "enough" when I'm out with friends eating dinner and enjoying the conversation. Somehow the company and the atmosphere keep my focus off the food which makes me eat slower and allows my body to read the signals of having had enough. I can't same the same of when I eat alone though, I'm a completely different eater when I'm by myself. I eat more, I watch tv but it doesn't distract me in the same way that good company does. I wonder if there's something to that.

I am the same, I think there is something to it. My family in France are all quite thin, and meal times are a big deal...there is no skipping lunch, there is hour+ long lunch breaks with coworkers/friends. When we were there my mother would even pick us up from school to eat lunch together. In the US we have a more frantic pace to life, I think that's not helpful when if comes to eating mindfully.
OP- Very interesting discussion! I suspect, as others have shared, that simple thermodynamics rule the day. I also know that the other factors influencing obesity are all too often ignored or cast aside with the phrase, "Just eat less and work out more!". I do get concerned that concept of being "naturally thin" convinces many people that they are "naturally fat", and thus incapable of losing weight.

AlanOliver
05-02-2013, 04:13 AM
If your are thinking for "Naturally thin" then I think YOGA is the best option with proper diet chart including protein shake.

Wannabeskinny
05-02-2013, 07:53 AM
I still envy my SIL for being able to say sweets are too sweet for her; I doubt I'll ever reach that point. But if I stay adamant and vigilant about my eating plan by tracking my food, I'm hoping to stay on top of things. I wish I could just be an intuitive eater, but at least I'm taking control now.

It IS possible! You CAN retrain your taste buds, especially when it comes to sweet. I remember when I gave up artificial sweeteners in my coffee a while back. I forced myself to do it and my coffee became like a form of torture. For 2 whole months every time I took a sip of non-sweetened coffee I'd think YUCK and I'd make a scrunchy face. I never thought I'd get used to it. And then one day suddenly it wasn't yucky anymore! I can't stand the thought of sweetness in my coffee anymore. Recently I got a cup of coffee at Dunkin Donuts and asked for milk-no sugar and they accidentally put sugar in it. I took one sip and spit it out YUCK!!!!!!

freelancemomma
05-02-2013, 09:05 AM
I do get concerned that concept of being "naturally thin" convinces many people that they are "naturally fat", and thus incapable of losing weight.

I agree. A while back I read a quote from an obesity doctor who said there isn't a person who can't lose weight on a medically supervised in-hospital program, where people are monitored 24/7 so they can't cheat.

That's why my first reaction to posts that say "I've been eating 800 calories per day for 2 months but haven't lost a pound" is skepticism. Hope I'm not offending anyone by saying this -- just sharing some honest thoughts.

F.

Amarantha2
05-02-2013, 09:49 AM
I agree with this & the post you quoted also. That is why I like threads like this where people can freely say what they think.

I agree. A while back I read a quote from an obesity doctor who said there isn't a person who can't lose weight on a medically supervised in-hospital program, where people are monitored 24/7 so they can't cheat.

That's why my first reaction to posts that say "I've been eating 800 calories per day for 2 months but haven't lost a pound" is skepticism. Hope I'm not offending anyone by saying this -- just sharing some honest thoughts.

F.

Elladorine
05-02-2013, 12:40 PM
It IS possible! You CAN retrain your taste buds, especially when it comes to sweet. I remember when I gave up artificial sweeteners in my coffee a while back. I forced myself to do it and my coffee became like a form of torture. For 2 whole months every time I took a sip of non-sweetened coffee I'd think YUCK and I'd make a scrunchy face. I never thought I'd get used to it. And then one day suddenly it wasn't yucky anymore! I can't stand the thought of sweetness in my coffee anymore. Recently I got a cup of coffee at Dunkin Donuts and asked for milk-no sugar and they accidentally put sugar in it. I took one sip and spit it out YUCK!!!!!!
I already have to a certain extent; I can enjoy those fruits now without pouring sugar all over them, it just took some time. :) I haven't really given myself the chance to find out if raw sugar and frosting and the like would be too sweet for me now, but I suspect it isn't. I could be wrong but I don't want to give myself the chance to fall back into old habits! :dizzy:

krampus
05-02-2013, 12:45 PM
I can't stand the thought of sweetness in my coffee anymore. Recently I got a cup of coffee at Dunkin Donuts and asked for milk-no sugar and they accidentally put sugar in it. I took one sip and spit it out YUCK!!!!!!

Yes! I've lost my taste for sugar in coffee and regular soda and generally like less sweet foods. I don't even like Chobani Bite or Flip unless it's for dessert.

I had ice cream for dinner last night though :dizzy:

lin43
05-02-2013, 05:02 PM
That's why my first reaction to posts that say "I've been eating 800 calories per day for 2 months but haven't lost a pound" is skepticism

ITA---particularly when the person says that they've been to the doctor, checked their thyroid, etc. Something doesn't add up there. There are exceptions to everything, but I just cannot accept that someone is eating so low, has no medical issue, and isn't losing.

zkharmaz
05-02-2013, 05:07 PM
Thank you for this analysis :)

Daimere
05-02-2013, 09:50 PM
You CAN retrain your taste buds, especially when it comes to sweet.
Maybe I should try that! It really would be easier to just have black coffee.

SouthernMaven
05-02-2013, 10:29 PM
It IS possible! You CAN retrain your taste buds, especially when it comes to sweet. I remember when I gave up artificial sweeteners in my coffee a while back. I forced myself to do it and my coffee became like a form of torture. For 2 whole months every time I took a sip of non-sweetened coffee I'd think YUCK and I'd make a scrunchy face. I never thought I'd get used to it. And then one day suddenly it wasn't yucky anymore! I can't stand the thought of sweetness in my coffee anymore. Recently I got a cup of coffee at Dunkin Donuts and asked for milk-no sugar and they accidentally put sugar in it. I took one sip and spit it out YUCK!!!!!!

This is similar to my experience.

When I was 18 & a freshman in college, I went on my first diet to lose the Freshman 15 (or in my case, 20). At the time I drank coffee loaded with cream and sugar. I didn't want to waste those calories in coffee so my RA told me that if I drank my coffee black for 30 days I wouldn't like it but I wouldn't be able to go back to drinking it with sugar.

I did what she suggested and I remember choking down coffee those first weeks. I went from being able to drink about a half-cup the first week back up to about two cups by the end of the 30 days. Still didn't like it, though.

So when the 30 days were up I tried it with cream and sugar again, just to see if what she said was true. Just like you, wannabeskinny, I had to spit it out. It was nasty.

It took me another few months to learn to actually ENJOY black coffee. Now it is the first thing I go for in the morning and nothing is more relaxing than having that warm cup of black coffee first thing every morning.

If anyone is trying to learn how to drink coffee black, believe me, this works.

Daimere
05-03-2013, 01:16 AM
Lately, I've tried to lower how much creamer I've used. I was using 4-5 non-dairy creamers, 5-6 sugars at work. Now I will do an almost exact TBSP of a liquid creamer if I have a choice with 1 splenda.

mandypandy2246
05-03-2013, 02:02 AM
It is so true! I actually have a close friend who researchers this.

One of the thing she always says is "you crave the foods that you know" ... and says that if you force a lifestyle change, after about three months, you will generally start craving the healthy foods you have been eating instead of junk!

Ronja
05-03-2013, 03:45 AM
You can absolutely train your taste buds, for sugar as well as for salt.

I've been using very little salt, as I cook for two toddlers. In the beginning, I would just cook everything without salt and then add some salt on my plate, but then I was too lazy to do that and actually got used to eating what my toddlers eat, i.ej. potatoes, rice, pasta or vegetables with very little salt.

Downside of this is I no more enjoy most meals in restaurants, as they're too salty for me!

Same with sugar, I've been on SBD for two weeks now and the other day I took a sip of coke...ewww, overly sweet now that I haven't been having anything sweet for two weeks. Truth is I haven't been using much arteficial sweataners either, so my taste buds had forgotten what sweets taste like. Never thought this would happen in just two weeks, and I was sugar addict before!

thewalrus0
05-03-2013, 06:49 AM
You should all watch the documentary on Youtube called "Why Thin People Aren't Fat".

It's about an hour long and it's really amazing.

Wannabeskinny
05-03-2013, 07:52 AM
You should all watch the documentary on Youtube called "Why Thin People Aren't Fat".

It's about an hour long and it's really amazing.

Can't wait, thanks!

ebb&flow
05-03-2013, 11:07 AM
Maybe I should try that! It really would be easier to just have black coffee.

I agree as well. Not the same as sugar, but I weaned my hubby down from whole milk to 1% by stepping down to the next level down of fat. Sometimes I would mix half of 2% and half of 1% until he got used to it, but eventually he said whole milk is too rich to drink.

Did the same thing with sugar in my coffee. I could never go cold turkey, so I just added one less packet until I go used to it, then stepped down again. Now I think the Starbucks creations are just too thick and sweet to drink.

NotTheCheat
05-03-2013, 11:20 AM
You should all watch the documentary on Youtube called "Why Thin People Aren't Fat".

It's about an hour long and it's really amazing.

Thanks - that was really fascinating.

Renwomin
05-03-2013, 05:59 PM
You should all watch the documentary on Youtube called "Why Thin People Aren't Fat".

It's about an hour long and it's really amazing.

I was going to mention this as well! It was interesting to see the varying degrees to which thin people gained weight when they were given large amounts of food to consume.

I've been searching desperately for the study regarding hunger that was conducted with five year olds and I can't find it. From memory they had five year olds eat until full. They all indicated they were full from a specific visual scale. Then they had them color and placed a plate of cookies on the table. Some of the full children didn't even touch the plate of cookies while others ate them even when they were full. I can't remember what the conclusion was regarding the difference in behavior, but I did find it interesting that there was such a clear distinction from a young age.

I tend to go straight to scientific studies regarding factors that lead to obesity. There is plenty of scientific evidence that suggests that genetic factors are related to fat gain and loss, hunger, and how our bodies process foods. There are even studies that indicate that people that were overweight would have to eat less than someone who was always thin to maintain the same body weight. There are studies that show that people's bodies react differently to exercise. Adding on to genetics are all the medical conditions individuals can have or necessary medicines for medical conditions that effect fat gain and/or loss.

If you tend to focus on these things it can be pretty depressing. I think though we have to each come to terms with the fact that regardless of genes, medical conditions, medications, and our bodies response to exercise among other things that are always things that we CAN control that will allow us to lose weight. But also because of their various factors, we should be realistic about our expectations for weight loss and ideal body weight. It is better to focus on the things we can change and let go of the things beyond our control.

Arctic Mama
05-03-2013, 06:43 PM
It is so true! I actually have a close friend who researchers this.

One of the thing she always says is "you crave the foods that you know" ... and says that if you force a lifestyle change, after about three months, you will generally start craving the healthy foods you have been eating instead of junk!

That's been my experience. Though I still occasionally crave things I don't eat like cake batter ice cream or teriyaki, many of my daily cravings are things like a rib eye steak or blueberries and cream (both of which I can and do eat regularly). When I haven't had a lot of roughage, I find myself craving salad, too!

And I had something happen this week that had me thinking about 'naturally thin'. My mother in law has been athletic and svelte her whole life. She's in great shape and seems to never struggle with food OR energy to be outside and moving around (my hobbies are the much more sedentary type, like knitting and reading, as opposed to triathlons and gardening like her).

But she spent a whole season out of town, living in a hotel while the state legislature was in session, and the long hours of committees, constant travel, and sub par food apparently even affected her! She commented that she wished she could do some meetings standing up (like she had seen in a TED talk) and that she'd put on ten pounds during the months she was gone and couldn't wait to get it off.

This is a womani would have sworn was completely intuitive in all her eating and activity, and didn't even own a scale. And yet not only did she have issues maintaining her weight in a stressful situation, she actually commented on needing to work it back off. I had always just assumed she didn't struggle with these things, because of the appearances and lack of issues in the past. But it looks like at least a small amount of awareness and normal life habits she has chosen are what help her stay trim, not just some miracle metabolism. While she is still definitely genetically predisposed to leanness, as her family and own post-menopausal body has clearly demonstrated, there is a level of choice and response I hadn't seen in her until now. She's naturally thin, but that doesn't mean thoughtlessly, effortlessly thin.

It was kind of eye opening, even though I always knew most thin folks put at least some effort, conscious or otherwise, into maintaining, it was a great illustration of the principle at a time when this forum had it on my mind. Thus, I had to share :D

Wannabeskinny
05-04-2013, 07:15 AM
That's been my experience. Though I still occasionally crave things I don't eat like cake batter ice cream or teriyaki, many of my daily cravings are things like a rib eye steak or blueberries and cream (both of which I can and do eat regularly). When I haven't had a lot of roughage, I find myself craving salad, too!

And I had something happen this week that had me thinking about 'naturally thin'. My mother in law has been athletic and svelte her whole life. She's in great shape and seems to never struggle with food OR energy to be outside and moving around (my hobbies are the much more sedentary type, like knitting and reading, as opposed to triathlons and gardening like her).

But she spent a whole season out of town, living in a hotel while the state legislature was in session, and the long hours of committees, constant travel, and sub par food apparently even affected her! She commented that she wished she could do some meetings standing up (like she had seen in a TED talk) and that she'd put on ten pounds during the months she was gone and couldn't wait to get it off.

This is a womani would have sworn was completely intuitive in all her eating and activity, and didn't even own a scale. And yet not only did she have issues maintaining her weight in a stressful situation, she actually commented on needing to work it back off. I had always just assumed she didn't struggle with these things, because of the appearances and lack of issues in the past. But it looks like at least a small amount of awareness and normal life habits she has chosen are what help her stay trim, not just some miracle metabolism. While she is still definitely genetically predisposed to leanness, as her family and own post-menopausal body has clearly demonstrated, there is a level of choice and response I hadn't seen in her until now. She's naturally thin, but that doesn't mean thoughtlessly, effortlessly thin.

It was kind of eye opening, even though I always knew most thin folks put at least some effort, conscious or otherwise, into maintaining, it was a great illustration of the principle at a time when this forum had it on my mind. Thus, I had to share :D

Sometimes we assume that naturally thin people don't have to put any thought into what they're doing but actually it requires some effort to stay naturally thin. The difference is that the effort they put into maintaining their health is not a struggle for them, it's matter of fact - like brushing your teeth. You don't have to constantly remember to brush your teeth it's just a habit you've formed since really young. Same thing with nutrition, they just KNOW that eating a box of cookies is out of the question where as we overweight people feel the need to contemplate a box of cookies on a regular basis.

Wannabehealthy
05-04-2013, 08:51 AM
I have an eating issue and I'm wondering if others have that same issue. I will eat when I'm not actually hungry if I think I'm going to be in a situation where there will not be any food available to me for a while. For example, last night we went out for dinner and I ordered a sandwich but only ate half of it. I brought it home, planning on saving it for lunch today, but when my husband decided we would go to watch my grandson's baseball game I gobbled up the other half of my sandwich. I was not hungry, but didn't know if there would be a concession stand etc IF I got hungry. I notice that I do that in many situations. Before I retired, I would always eat something on my morning break, not because I was hungry, but because I wasn't sure I could go until lunch without getting hungry. It really wouldn't have hurt me to be a little hungry for a while before lunch.

Wannabehealthy
05-04-2013, 08:54 AM
I agree as well. Not the same as sugar, but I weaned my hubby down from whole milk to 1% by stepping down to the next level down of fat. Sometimes I would mix half of 2% and half of 1% until he got used to it, but eventually he said whole milk is too rich to drink.



I didn't think I would ever get my husband to use fat free milk, but I did the same thing....did it gradually. One day recently he ran to the convenience store for milk and accidentally grabbed whole milk. He was eating cereal and he said "There's something wrong with this milk." He smelled it and it smelled ok but he was going to dump it out until he noticed the label. He could not stand whole milk anymore! LOL

Wannabeskinny
05-04-2013, 09:11 AM
I have an eating issue and I'm wondering if others have that same issue. I will eat when I'm not actually hungry if I think I'm going to be in a situation where there will not be any food available to me for a while. ....

Oh yes. I do that. Many times I will eat a whole meal in secret right before going out to dinner. I do it if I know I'm going to dinner with people who are vegetarians or vegan, that I just KNOW are going to eat like a bird. Their eating makes me nervous and extremely hungry and I feel like a fat slob if I order a cheeseburger and fries. Sometimes I wonder if they're all pre eating their meals before going out for a meal lol.

Amarantha2
05-04-2013, 10:43 AM
I do this too. It is a habit I have tried to get rid of for decades because really I am fine on occasions when I do get hungry & am not anywhere I can really eat. There is never an emergency to eat for me. I can wait but I always feel worried I might get hungry.

I have an eating issue and I'm wondering if others have that same issue. I will eat when I'm not actually hungry if I think I'm going to be in a situation where there will not be any food available to me for a while. For example, last night we went out for dinner and I ordered a sandwich but only ate half of it. I brought it home, planning on saving it for lunch today, but when my husband decided we would go to watch my grandson's baseball game I gobbled up the other half of my sandwich. I was not hungry, but didn't know if there would be a concession stand etc IF I got hungry. I notice that I do that in many situations. Before I retired, I would always eat something on my morning break, not because I was hungry, but because I wasn't sure I could go until lunch without getting hungry. It really wouldn't have hurt me to be a little hungry for a while before lunch.

Amarantha2
05-04-2013, 10:47 AM
This is why I don't like the term "naturally thin" as everyone IMO will be either thin or not thin depending on circumstances & behavior.

That's been my experience. Though I still occasionally crave things I don't eat like cake batter ice cream or teriyaki, many of my daily cravings are things like a rib eye steak or blueberries and cream (both of which I can and do eat regularly). When I haven't had a lot of roughage, I find myself craving salad, too!

And I had something happen this week that had me thinking about 'naturally thin'. My mother in law has been athletic and svelte her whole life. She's in great shape and seems to never struggle with food OR energy to be outside and moving around (my hobbies are the much more sedentary type, like knitting and reading, as opposed to triathlons and gardening like her).

But she spent a whole season out of town, living in a hotel while the state legislature was in session, and the long hours of committees, constant travel, and sub par food apparently even affected her! She commented that she wished she could do some meetings standing up (like she had seen in a TED talk) and that she'd put on ten pounds during the months she was gone and couldn't wait to get it off.

This is a womani would have sworn was completely intuitive in all her eating and activity, and didn't even own a scale. And yet not only did she have issues maintaining her weight in a stressful situation, she actually commented on needing to work it back off. I had always just assumed she didn't struggle with these things, because of the appearances and lack of issues in the past. But it looks like at least a small amount of awareness and normal life habits she has chosen are what help her stay trim, not just some miracle metabolism. While she is still definitely genetically predisposed to leanness, as her family and own post-menopausal body has clearly demonstrated, there is a level of choice and response I hadn't seen in her until now. She's naturally thin, but that doesn't mean thoughtlessly, effortlessly thin.

It was kind of eye opening, even though I always knew most thin folks put at least some effort, conscious or otherwise, into maintaining, it was a great illustration of the principle at a time when this forum had it on my mind. Thus, I had to share :D

freelancemomma
05-04-2013, 12:09 PM
I've been searching desperately for the study regarding hunger that was conducted with five year olds and I can't find it. From memory they had five year olds eat until full. They all indicated they were full from a specific visual scale. Then they had them color and placed a plate of cookies on the table. Some of the full children didn't even touch the plate of cookies while others ate them even when they were full. I can't remember what the conclusion was regarding the difference in behavior, but I did find it interesting that there was such a clear distinction from a young age.

That study was actually described in the documentary referenced above ("Why are thin people not fat"). As far as I'm concerned it was the most interesting part of the documentary. You could see some kids pushing their plates away in annoyance, while others kept eating "just because." (Well, just because it was yummy stuff like chocolate and cookies.) My hunch has always been that this variable (i.e., likelihood of continuing to eat after reaching physiological satiety) contributes the most to differences in girth among humans.

F.

lin43
05-04-2013, 04:18 PM
That documentary on YouTube was really interesting, but even after seeing all that, I still have one question: If these differences mainly are genetic (i.e., our body has a natural "set point"), why weren't those differences as pronounced in the 40's or 50's, for instance?

Chronostasis
05-04-2013, 04:49 PM
That documentary on YouTube was really interesting, but even after seeing all that, I still have one question: If these differences mainly are genetic (i.e., our body has a natural "set point"), why weren't those differences as pronounced in the 40's or 50's, for instance?I'm far too young to know much about the 40s and 50s, but I would think a major difference is in "normal" portions then vs. "normal" portions now. There are several good videos on the topic on Youtube.

lin43
05-04-2013, 05:02 PM
I'm far too young to know much about the 40s and 50s, but I would think a major difference is in "normal" portions then vs. "normal" portions now. There are several good videos on the topic on Youtube.

Yes, I know, but what I gleaned from the documentary is that some are genetically predisposed to be thin while others are not. As such, it seems like regardless of how much food is around, those who are genetically predisposed to be thin would still be thin because they wouldn't want to overeat no matter what foods are abundant----according to the documentary. Even if people who are genetically predisposed to be fat get fatter because of big portions, shouldn't those genetically predisposed to be thin stay the same? Why are the numbers of obese people higher now than before? In the documentary, I found it fascinating that the bodies/minds of the naturally thin folks rebelled, in various ways, to the over-consumption of food (i.e., some had a gag reflex & just could not force themselves to eat more; another participant actually gained muscle despite having done no exercise and that extra muscle increased his metabolism to fight against weight gain; the scientist conjectured that two others fidgeted more to get rid of the extra energy).

Arctic Mama
05-04-2013, 05:18 PM
I don't think it is primarily genetic. Food environment has a whole lot to do with it. Not to mention the physiological response to food (endocrine theory) compounds and accelerates each generation.

So if there is an interaction among genetics, industrial foodstuffs, and our body's increasing inability to tolerate the inflammation caused by some of these factors (note the increase in things like IBS and food allergies) - then all you need is to add in an improper response to hunger (like boredom eating and the easy availability of nutritionally poor food) and more sedentary behavior - somewhat abruptly we observe a significant portion of the population that previously would only be subject to a middle aged spread hitting record levels of obesity and corresponding ailments like diabetes, heart disease, high cholesterol, etc etc.

I support an endocrine theory for obesity, meaning that obesity and overeating are symptoms of a dysfunction in the body's energy processing and hormonal response to food input, not the root cause of it. But that doesn't preclude all the above factors also affecting the equation. And while solving it can be as simple for some people as just adopting more mindful eating habits and using an external check like calorie counting, for a fair portion of the population they must address the physiological problems as well as the behavioral and environmental interference.

Smartermommy
05-04-2013, 05:30 PM
Just want to say thank you for your post. You described my husband and I to a T. I've never heard it explained this way but that is exactly us!


I have a naturally thin husband and a naturally thin mother. So I've been able to observe quite closely how they eat. There are times they over indulge, just like anyone. However, they make up for it later by not eating anything later and having very light meals the next day. It's like normal people at Thanksgiving - they stuff themselves and then they say "I won't be eating for days" and then they literally hardly eat anything the next day! Not me, everyday is Thanksgiving. One big meal does not affect my ability to eat a big meal later in the day or the next day. It's this sense of balance that keeps people natural.

Another thing that I've noticed in thin people is their reaction to hunger. They don't seem upset by it. My husband can be hungry but wait for dinner, my mother can skip a whole meal if you ask her to. Both can go to bed without dinner and not have any sense of deprivation. For me I react to hunger differently, and that's what I'm trying to change. I don't want to be consumed by hunger, which often brings out anger in me.

LiannaKole
05-06-2013, 01:46 PM
slmn11: Absolutely! I frequently feel the urge to overeat, and DO overeat when I will be somewhere that I don't think there will be any food. I'm trying to work on that now, actually.

One thing that helps is if I take a snack that I know will fill me up enough that I won't be hungry (a Clif bar, some almonds and a tangerine, etc.).

Another thing that I've found helps is to never let myself get too hungry. Then that mindset kicks in where I'm like, "OMG, there's no food. I have to find food." No idea why. It's baffling. Consciously I know I'll never starve, but subconsciously I know no such thing. Carrying a snack helps with this, too. Then I can nibble on it, or I at least know it's there if needed.

---

And on the topic of natural thinness, I do think there is something to the whole genetics thing. Some people honestly need less food to be a certain weight, some people are predisposed to eat more/less and move more/less. But a lot of it is also environment (transportation, available foods, income, culture, family, etc.) and how you were raised. Kids who are overweight/obese are much more likely to remain so as adults.

I think some of it is genetics and a lot is environment, and that habits are very, very important. I think naturally easily-gain-weight people can lose the weight, but it would take a drastic life change that many cannot or will not do.

lin43: And as for the differences between now and the 1930s or 40s, I think in earlier decades food was not as abundant or easily accessible, normal portions were smaller, and people had to move a lot more (fewer people owned cars, people grew their own food, more physical-work jobs, etc.). So those things kept genetics/predispositions in check in a way.

JoJoP
05-06-2013, 01:51 PM
I can easily imagine that someone who doesn't experience constant food cravings, and has a mild appetite, could be "naturally thin."

thewalrus0
05-06-2013, 08:20 PM
The issue I've been having all my life is with people who believe hunger is all in your head. Someone who is 'naturally thin' might exercise some restraint but when they see chocolate cake, even if they want it a bit, they don't necessarily want to eat it as much as someone who struggles with cravings. The strength of a craving and an urge to overeat varies between people and I think a lot of the prejudice that forms is from people who honestly believe everyone staring at a treat is feeling the exact same feelings all the time. It's simply not true.

So people have this idea that everyone feels the same way and then they find it simple to cut back a bit, exercise a little more and they lose weight and it doesn't feel so hard. They are assuming that for us it should be the same way, but it isn't for everyone.

That's something I wish people could see.

freelancemomma
05-06-2013, 08:52 PM
The strength of a craving and an urge to overeat varies between people and I think a lot of the prejudice that forms is from people who honestly believe everyone staring at a treat is feeling the exact same feelings all the time. It's simply not true.

I absolutely, totally, 10000% agree. As I've mentioned before on this board, I realized this at age 8 when my best friend opened a drawer and retrieved some Halloween candy she'd collected several months earlier. I asked her how she'd been able to resist eating it all those months, and she told me she'd simply forgotten about it.

I firmly believe that differences in what I call attraction to food account for most of the differences in weight among people, rather than differences in metabolic rate.

F.

Ija
05-06-2013, 11:08 PM
I absolutely, totally, 10000% agree. As I've mentioned before on this board, I realized this at age 8 when my best friend opened a drawer and retrieved some Halloween candy she'd collected several months earlier. I asked her how she'd been able to resist eating it all those months, and she told me she'd simply forgotten about it.

I'm having a similar experience now. My housemates are a young couple who are both very, very thin (the female is 6' tall and 130-135 pounds; she occasionally models). They generally cook very healthy, fresh food, but they also keep ENORMOUS quantities of junk food in the house... ice cream, giant Costco-size bags of candy bar "minis", grocer bakery cookies, several different kinds of chips. But unlike yours truly, whose attention zooms in on the junk as soon as hits my visual field, they don't seem to notice it even though it's out in the open. Sometimes at night they'll sit on the couch and watch TV with the bag of minis between them, and over the course of a two hour movie they'll each have eaten two or three... it's been sitting on the kitchen counter for six months now and it's still over half full. There are four half-eaten pints of ice cream in the freezer, three of which haven't been touched in ages (major freezer burn gives it away). I'm afraid to see what the chips look like, who knows how old all those bags are.

When they dig into the fresh bakery cookies, they'll each break off a chunk of one, eat it over the course of five minutes and be satisfied with just those couple of bites.

"Naturally thin" people are just... different. They enjoy food, maybe even tremendously so, but without feeling any compulsive urges to eat it.

freelancemomma
05-06-2013, 11:54 PM
[QUOTE=Ija;4732879
When they dig into the fresh bakery cookies, they'll each break off a chunk of one, eat it over the course of five minutes and be satisfied with just those couple of bites.[/QUOTE]

God, that's annoying (because I envy it, of course).

F.

thewalrus0
05-07-2013, 01:32 AM
I'm starting to accept that, for me, food is tempting to a point where it's sometimes impossible to resist.

Some people have this, some people don't. I might live with it forever, but I'd rather try to work with what I know about myself so that I can lose this weight and be healthier, instead of worry about how some people have it easier.

Some people are born deformed or lose limbs and a lot of them continue on to do things they love and I imagine it's incredibly hard for them but if they thought all the time about how some people don't have to deal with the thing they're dealing with they would probably never even try.

I've dreamed about finding a way to be like those people, but I think in the end the best thing is eating less, or no, processed foods, avoid drinking your calories, eat satisfying foods and exercise for your mental health. Doing things you love that aren't food related and try to come to peace with that part of yourself.

I know I haven't had success yet, but I firmly believe in staying positive and pushing on. So many people give up and I refuse to do that. :)

Maybe as time goes on things will get easier, but I have to say that I absolutely can not eat half a cookie and be okay.

Ronja
05-07-2013, 02:48 AM
I just want to say Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, freelancemomma and everyone who's been sharing their thoughts. Reading your comments and experiences has been so interesting, and not every day you stubmle across something that changes the way you percieve yourself and your own life.
As I was reading this, I actually had tears in my eyes and I wondered why...then I realized I've always pretty much thought I WAS THE ONLY ONE.

I always, even subconsciously, thought I was the only one not to be able to eat half a cookie and be satisfied...the only one who will have full dinner but always find a space for dessert, I've always thought I was kind of broken in this way. I mean if you asked me, I would just down right tell you it's not the case and surely there are other obese people who have a same problem, but I didn't really LIVE as if it was a truth. I've lived in some sort of mental isolation from others, always trying to hide my cravings (because I could see my friends and family were not like that at all). I mean if we went on a trip with friends and cooked together, I would bring extra cookies and chocolate and HIDE IT, just so that I could eat after we've had oure common dinner everyone seemed to be satisfied with. Things like that, you know? The feeling you have to keep it secret, because you are weird.

Just knowing it's not me, but some sort of a genetical/upbringing/environmental mixture that messes with other people's heads too just made my life a lot easier in some way.

I still have to fight my cravings, my hate of excercising, I will have to watch what I eat and how I eat for the rest of my life...but somehow I now feel less quilty of it, and more ready to accept it as a simple truth, not anymore defeated by comparing my own eating ways to the ways of my friends...thank you so much!

Wannabeskinny
05-07-2013, 07:53 AM
I always, even subconsciously, thought I was the only one not to be able to eat half a cookie and be satisfied...the only one who will have full dinner but always find a space for dessert, I've always thought I was kind of broken in this way. I mean if you asked me, I would just down right tell you it's not the case and surely there are other obese people who have a same problem, but I didn't really LIVE as if it was a truth. I've lived in some sort of mental isolation from others, always trying to hide my cravings (because I could see my friends and family were not like that at all). I mean if we went on a trip with friends and cooked together, I would bring extra cookies and chocolate and HIDE IT, just so that I could eat after we've had oure common dinner everyone seemed to be satisfied with. Things like that, you know? The feeling you have to keep it secret, because you are weird.



This is the truth for many of us. It's classic binge-eater or COE mentality. The fear of being without food, the secretiveness of hiding food. For many years the only way I could cope with my anxiety issues was to hide a bag of chips in my closet. As long as I knew the bag of chips was there I would feel calm. And always, always this feeling of not understanding how others were satisfied with a light dinner. I wouldn't even call it an addiction, it's like living in an alternate universe, a universe where one is only comfortable with the over abundance of food.

lin43
05-07-2013, 06:31 PM
God, that's annoying (because I envy it, of course).

F.

LOL!--My thoughts exactly!

Arctic Mama
05-08-2013, 03:37 AM
Oh Ronja, you're NOT the only one, by a long shot. And believe it or not, many of us folks maintaining huge losses still struggle with this. It CAN be managed and even beaten, effectively, even if the temptation doesn't go away. Learning strategies that work for our individual bodies and minds and then reinforcing them day after day really is what it takes for most of us. It's doable, definitely.

Amarantha2
05-08-2013, 08:38 AM
It is doable, without a doubt.

gailr42
05-08-2013, 09:55 AM
I was naturally skinny for quite a few years. Over time, I guess I got less exercise and got older and the eating caught up with me. Somewhere along the way, I started hiding and sneaking food. It seems pretty similar to hiding a bottle of booze to consume in private. I have done that, too, but quit some time back.

Two things happened that helped me with the need to have food always available. First, I realized that nothing bad would happen if I didn't have extra food with me. I wouldn't starve and die over the period of a weekend. Second, I started carrying something healthy with me when I knew I might get genuinely hungry. Like on a day out of town shopping where lunch might get delayed.

I was at a mountain cabin with friends last weekend. People brought all kinds of good food; some healthy, some not. My friend and I stopped at the grocery store for bird seed!?, and as an afterthought, I bought this huge bag of mandarin oranges because it was on sale, and I am trying to eat healthy. I dumped the oranges in a bowl and put it out to share. Folks just fell on those oranges. Everyone was munching away with orange fingers and peelings all over the place. None of these people are overweight and maybe they just like healthier food. I was really impressed with their gusto. I reserve that kind of love for things like cheese cake.

I think those we are calling naturally skinny might have naturally good eating habits coupled with a lack of attraction to food that many of us on here feel. I never had good eating habits even when I was a supper skinny child. Improving our eating habits is just one more tool we can use in the fight against our "fatal attraction". It is certainly less damaging to eat a bag of oranges than a whole cheese cake.

This has been a great discussion. Thanks for starting it, Freelance.

Amarantha2
05-08-2013, 10:36 AM
The phrase you used interested me, Gayle: "... those we are calling naturally skinny. ..."

For me that sums this up and I agree with you about those some are calling naturally skinny having better eating habits that some of us (meaning me).

Sorry to post again. This is a great discussion but I do have a little issue with the 3FC threads that seem to pop up that are kind of like discussing labels some put on others such as "naturally skinny" and to paraphrase others: things our thin friends don't get or things obese people don't get (think I saw one like that) or, for that matter talking about "us" as in we who are on 3FC.

I think everyone is human and weight is a function of various things and that not everyone on 3FC is naturally overweight or naturally thin. I think that could be a discouraging concept for anyone who struggles with weight or food issues. We do not all think alike, want the same things, or see things in the same light. Our bodies don't all function exactly the same way but we are all subject to the biology of being human.

Still, a very good discussion and hope everyone has a good day.

Wannabehealthy
05-08-2013, 10:38 AM
My father was never overweight but he was sick. My mother was "normal size" until after he passed away. She was 41 at that time...I was 11. I don't know why she gained weight after he died, and I never even gave it a thought until reading this thread. I was "normal size" until I got my first job. Before that I ate all my meals at home. After I started eating lunch in restaurants I started to gain weight. I didn't realize that I was eating a dinner-size meal at lunch time. When I realized I was gaining, I started to watch and maintained my weight around 130 lbs for years. I was not naturally thin. I had to really watch my eating and exercised regularly. It was after I got married that I put on all this weight. My husband wants me to eat when he eats. Because I love food, I was all to willing, but now I'm sorry I did it. I can't seem to get back to the lifestyle I maintained for so long. I don't understand why he can't eat unless I'm eating too. If I want something, I don't care if no one else is eating!

lin43
05-08-2013, 11:29 AM
My husband wants me to eat when he eats. . . . I don't understand why he can't eat unless I'm eating too. If I want something, I don't care if no one else is eating!

My husband is somewhat similar. He has never had a weight problem, but he likes eating and drinking (even if it's just coffee) socially. I went along with it for years, but I stopped some time ago because I realized that I was getting to be the same weight he is (which isn't good when you consider that he is 6 ft and I'm 5 ft 3). Initially, he tried to cajole me into eating all that he ate (including extremely fattening gourmet dinners he cooks), but now he just accepts that I won't (usually). In fact, I often will eat a different meal from what he is eating for dinner. He likes fried foods with cream sauces, and if I ate that way even a few times a week, I would either gain weight or have to restrict too much on other foods I enjoy. So, my advice is to stand firm. He'll get over it.

Wannabeskinny
05-08-2013, 04:09 PM
My father was never overweight but he was sick. My mother was "normal size" until after he passed away. She was 41 at that time...I was 11. I don't know why she gained weight after he died, and I never even gave it a thought until reading this thread. I was "normal size" until I got my first job. Before that I ate all my meals at home. After I started eating lunch in restaurants I started to gain weight. I didn't realize that I was eating a dinner-size meal at lunch time. When I realized I was gaining, I started to watch and maintained my weight around 130 lbs for years. I was not naturally thin. I had to really watch my eating and exercised regularly. It was after I got married that I put on all this weight. My husband wants me to eat when he eats. Because I love food, I was all to willing, but now I'm sorry I did it. I can't seem to get back to the lifestyle I maintained for so long. I don't understand why he can't eat unless I'm eating too. If I want something, I don't care if no one else is eating!

Eating a "dinner-sized meal at lunchtime" is not necessarily a bad thing. In Europe where I grew up we ate a continental breakfast (bread with butter and jam) and had a very large meal at lunchtime, that is the main meal of the day. Dinner is usually very light and it works well - ever hear the saying Eat breakfast like a King, lunch like a prince, and dinner like a pauper? Good stuff :)

Ronja
05-08-2013, 04:22 PM
I couldn't agree more. Eating "dinner" for lunch and then just a salad or sandwich in the evening is quite healthy and well, just the way we do it here in Europe. I find my body doesn't like to process big meals in the evening so when I'm abroad visiting friends, I try to limit my dinner but I also need more food in midday which they consider quite strange!

magical
05-08-2013, 04:40 PM
I certainly fit the saying "Eat breakfast like a King, lunch like a prince, and dinner like a pauper"

My main meal is usually mid-morning around 11 am, then most days I don't even eat dinner as I'm full right up till night time!

Arctic Mama
05-08-2013, 06:57 PM
Eating a "dinner-sized meal at lunchtime" is not necessarily a bad thing. In Europe where I grew up we ate a continental breakfast (bread with butter and jam) and had a very large meal at lunchtime, that is the main meal of the day. Dinner is usually very light and it works well - ever hear the saying Eat breakfast like a King, lunch like a prince, and dinner like a pauper? Good stuff :)

That's actually how I'm eating right now, after messing around with meal times and amounts I find fasting all night and late into the morning, then having a good break, huge and grazing lunch, and essentially a snack for dinner, works very well for controlling my hunger right now :)