PCOS/Insulin Resistance Support - Facial Hair

First,

Let me say that I have never been diagnosed with PCOS, but I have been reading about some of the symptoms. One symptom that I have and have had for several years is excessive facial hair.

Before starting the WOE, I had to remove hairs from my chin and neck area constantly - part of my daily routine. Ever since I have been LC'ing, the quantity of facial hair has been cut by 75%!

I was wondering if anyone has also made this connection on this WOL or if it's just a happy coincidence for me???

Thanks,
Kristi

WOL?

Facial hair is connected to the levels of testosterone and other androgens. These are controlled by the insulin. PCOSers tend to either produce too much insulin (not common) or the body is just ignoring it. Eating too much sugar (sugar=carbs) creates more insulin OR quicker insulin responce which inturn makes the PCOS body have problems. L/Cing (or Diabetic Type 2 diets) help the insulin production/responce therefore helps to decrease the androgens/testies. So yes, there is a huge connection there.

Thanks for your response :)

I'm sorry, what do WOE and LC'ing mean?

I don't have PCOS either but am diagnosed with Insulin Resistance and Impaired Fasting Glucose. I am also overweight (253 on 5'3" body). I've been doing electrolysis for face & neck for perhaps 3 years. They're greatly reduced, but new ones keep coming in. I was told it was because of ingreased hormones due to my fat.

France from Ottawa
259 / 253 / under 200

WOE is way of eating. LC'ing is eating a diet which contains fewer carbs that the "norm".

Hope this helps.

(There is a whole section on Low Carbing right after the Weight Watchers forum. Come and check it out!)

Hey, I grew up in Ottawa!

Frapilu:

Try to find a PCOS doc in your area. Im sure you are indeed PCOS. http://www.pcosupport.org/membership/professionals.php If none listed, contact your local or nearby PCOSA group to get their recommendations http://chapters.pcosupport.org/us/

Hey!! i have been diagnosed with pcos and do have some facial hair!! I cannot stand it, it drives me insane. I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions of what to do for longer results, besides dipilatories, bleaching, and tweezing. Thanks!!!

Electrolisis. This lasts LONGER but not forever. Its also expensive.

Waxing lasts longer

There is a drug out there Vinequa $40. a tube. This helps keep hair away.

Diet!!!! This is very important. Read the diet posts. Getting rid of the excess testosterone will alleviate some of the hair.

GlucophageXR. This treats PCOS.

Lastly, spirolactane (sp?). This is a pill you take every day. It can take up to 6 to 8 months to even show signs of working. I myself wont do this because I dont see the point in taking a medication for ONE symptom every single day. Im quite happy on Gluc. The hair process has slowed.

Thanks for letting me know!!! Where do you get that Vinequa? Is it a prescription or can you get it over the counter and if so, where can you get it cause i have never heard of it. Also, that spirolactane, is that strictly for treating pcos and works like the glucophage, which in turn, slows the hair growth down, or is it strictly for slowing hair growth? I appreciate you letting me know about these alternatives cause those are meds I never heard of. Also, I was on glucophage for about 7 or 8 months and my doctor really wanted me on 2 a day and taking 2 a day was making me light-headed. I stuck to 1 a day and he decided to take me off of it cause he said that I would really need 2 to get the effects of it. He feels that as long as I stick to a diet and lose the weight, it will alleviate everything on top of my ultimate goal right now, which is to get pregnant. I have been trying since January of this year. I have been on prometrium(progesterone) and clomid(fertility medicine). The clomid was supposed to ensure that I ovulate, which, go figure, I didn't ovulate at all. I guess that is the breaks. I try not to get to annoyed about it cause I learned the hard way that it doesn't help!!! Anyway, thanks for you suggestions cause I will definitely be looking into it, but, like I asked earlier, please let me know if I need prescriptions or it is over the counter. Thanks again!!!

Vinequa is new, a cream, script only. Spiro is script too but ONLY works for the hair and thats it. Spiro does NOTHING for PCOS. Thats important to know. Its strictly a cosmetic pill.

I suggest looking back into gluc. He's right, 500mg does nothing for the majority of PCOSers. Most dosages are in the 1500mg to 2500mg range while the majority is on 1800mg or 2000mg. There are ways of dealing with the symptoms. Also, look into the glucXR version which is a one a day dosing and is MUCH better on the side effects. I take mine at night just before bed. I know I get dizzy on it too from when I missed a dose once and had to do it in the AM. But, during night, Im asleep. By morning, Im myself so its like nothing ever happened. In my opinion, gluc is SOOOO vitally important. Somethign to try to work through. The first several months, took me 4, are the worst of course. After that, it should be smooth sailing.

As for the clomid. No surprise. Clomid doesnt always work for PCOSers. Sounds like your PCOS is pretty severe. I didnt do anything until my 3rd month on 150mg of clomid alone. BUT, I did respond to 100mg clomid when I started gluc. Gluc can make the difference here too.

HopefulSpirits,

I don't think I have PCOS. I had an ultrasound just before Christmas. They found a fibroid tumour but said my ovaries were perfectly ok. Wouldn't PCOS show up in my ovaries (I really know nothing about PCOS)?

Thanks anyways. I've started Metformin for the Insulin Resistance -- low dose to start: 2 x 1/2 pill of 500 mg per day. I've lost 6 lbs in the 1 month I've been taking it. I'm seeing my doctor again Sept 20. I wonder if the Metformin could help with the hair? That would be soooo nice; I'm soooo tired of electrolysis!

I've started using Biore's new Beyond Smooth moisturizing cream that's suppose to reduce facial hair so we'll see how that goes.

frapilu

Wow, your doc needs some educating. PCO and PCOS are NOT the same. PCO is simply a symptom. You can have PCOS and not have PCO (infact 30% of all PCOSers do not have PCO), you can have PCO and not be PCOS. This is the number 1 misunderstood issue about PCOS. Cysts DO NOT diagnose PCOS. The ONLY thing that diagnoses PCOS is blood work, which you have. YOu stated yourself on top of the symptoms you have...if I were a doc...Id diagnose you right now. You are a classic PCOSer. I didnt have cysts for YEARS and YEARS! I dont have them once again too. I had them a very short time but Im still and have always been PCOS.

Your met dose is sooo low that I doubt its doing ANYTHING for you. Again, the average dose is 1800mg to 2000mg a day. 500mg a day is sooo minute, its RARE that this will improve anything. Dont be surprised if everything comes back the same as it was pregluc or barely adjusted.

My site for more information: http://pcos.itgo.com

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE find a PCOS knowledgeable doc in your area. http://www.pcosupport.org/membership/professionals.php If none listed, contact your local or nearby PCOSA group to get their recommendations http://chapters.pcosupport.org/us/

HopefulSpirits,

The ignorance is mine, not my doctor's. We've just started the whole process. I consider her amazingly wonderful to have suspected Insulin Resistance and to have tested me for it. I tried to get my husband's doctor to test him (I'm sure he has it) and the jerk refused since my husband isn't diabetic (nor am I).

My doctor has started me on a low dose of Metformin because the side effects are supposed to be not so bad when you start low and increase gradually. I have not had any side effects at all. As I said, I'm seeing her Sept 20 and I'm sure she'll be increasing my dose then.

I'll definitely read the sites you mention. So what bloodwork diagnoses PCOS? I've had fasting glucose & serum insulin level tested, both abnormal. Presumably, once I get up to a higher dose of Metformin, you believe this would help with the facial hair?

frapilu

Appologies, I assumed because she hasnt diagnosed you yet and because she didnt say that it didnt rule out PCOS when your u/s came back normal. Im so used to hearing about docs that exclude PCOS because of things like lack of cysts.

You can learn more at my website. http://pcos.itgo.com There is a ton of info and articles there at the bottom right hand corner. As well as http://4.43.98.80/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64987 and http://4.43.98.80/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12947

Yes, metformin will help with all the symptoms because its treating the PCOS and IR. Insulin controls the hormones. When there are IR issues, the hormones are out of wack. Its the hormones that cause the cysts, acne, hair, etc. Fix the insulin issue, and the rest start to get better.

As for the graduality of the medication, its really only necessary for a minimum of 7 days. Thats the normal protocol. Increasing every 7 days. Some do it every 2 weeks. GlucXR is the best though in my opinion. Ive had both.

GL! Sorry for the confusion.

Back when I had the u/s, we were looking for fibroids since it's in my family & my periods were driving me crazy. The Insulin Resistance came later. U/s was before Xmas. Insulin Resistance was Aug 1. In fact, with hindsight, I remember my doctor saying that the Insulin Resistance meant that I might also have PCOS, then she muttered about the u/s, then shook her head and said something like "let's do one thing at a time here. Treat your Insulin Resistance and get you to diabetes education and we'll see about the rest". Later when I was getting my next depo-provera shot, I was complaining that I've been bleeding continuously (it's my 3rd shot, periods had stopped then started up again -- will they ever stop!!??), she referred back to my Insulin Resistance and said that the Metformin would likely help the problem with my periods.

frapilu

For facial hair, my endo suggest laser therapy. There are new machines out now that are much better than the ones in recent years. My dr says that it takes at least 3 sessions, maybe more, depending on your hair growth. You cannot tweeze for 4 weeks
(I think that is the #) and cannot shave for a few days ahead of time. They will zap what is there, go for a second time for what was under the skin when you got it the first time, then go back for new hair growth the third time, then continue as needed until it is gone. My sister is getting it done there and she said it isn't as painful as it was the old way, either. She did electolysis for years also. It is much cheaper than electrolysis overall, since you only have to go a few times, not years. She said they dimmed the lights and put on Enya and it was pretty relaxing!

Look for a PCOS specialist in your area and see if they offer laser therapy. My PCOS center just got one a couple of months ago and they are charging much less than traditional laser therapy. They know it is a terrible problem for PCOSers and only want to cover the price of the machine. Maybe you can find a similar deal!

I've heard mixed reviews on the Vaniqua. One doctor said the results weren't as spectacular as they hoped, another highly recommended it. Your hair will still grow back, only slower.One tube, although expensive, will probably last a long time, so it is worth a try. I use a retin cream (about the same size tube) to keep my face clear and it lasts about 4 months.

I am not getting anything done to my hair. I have some hair growth but it isn't bad enough that I can't keep up with it yet. I
have noticed that it slows down as I lose weight, and as long as I eat right, the acne stays at bay as well. I am taking 1000mg of Gluc XR. I will move up in a month or so....I've had stomach problems with it! I'm overly sensitive to meds though.

I had heard that for the laser therapy, you had to have dark hair. An aunt of mine does laser therapy and she told me my hairs wouldn't be picked up by the laser. Is this a different type of laser therapy than the usual?

frapilu

Hello,

I was diagnosed as having PCOS many years ago ... and only by reading this site (for the first time last week) have I realised how things have moved on since I was diagnosed. I have had no active treatment since diagnosis... when I was diagnosed PCOS was only recently recognised

However, without knowing it - and not for PCOS, I have had treatment - Depo Provera injections. This has helped with my hair loss - and also the facial and body hair is much less now - but I have been on depo for 12 years!!

Also I discovered by accident - and without knowing why - that I feel much better in myself if I reduce my carb intake. Seems to be particularly complex carbs that affect me ... fruit does not seem to affect me in the same way.

Recently I have started using a cream Bio-Depiless - they have creams for face, body - and a deoderant (but I dont use this as excessive perspiration is also one of my problem areas). I ordered this cream from a TV Shopping Channel in the UK ...
So far it appears to be helping - in that I dont have to tweezer as often .

Mo:

Please do a search on "PCOS Depo Provera". You may be quite alarmed. Its different for PCOSers as opposed to nonPCOSers. Please do this search in your favorite search engine.

Also its VITAL that you know BCP/Shots are NOT a treatment plan for PCOS. The PCOS is still aging, you are still having other issues secretly inside you. Doing these sorts of "symptom treatments" ONLY help with acne directly (not the cause of), menses and ovaries. Thats it.

This means, without PROPER PCOS treatment, such as glucophage/avandia/etc, diabetic type 2 diet, exercise, et al, you are STILL at equal risk; as those PCOSers that are being completely UNTREARED, for diabetes, heart disease, heart attacks, strokes and more. Cancer risk is lowered while on BCP/S the same as others because you are shedding every month.

Please, for your health, seek more treatment plans. If you want to stay on the DP - fine, but that is not enough to TREAT the PCOS.

Hi

Thanks for the reply ... I will go off and do some research and take my findings back to the doctor

I too am IR and believe I am PCOS however the Dr's won't even consider checking because I have had children so therefore I must not be....
Anyway, I have always suffered from excessive facial hair. I have very white skin and very black hair. I literally could remove the hair every single day. I would wax, bleach you name it. I constantly had a hand over my lower face in order to hide it. The hairs on my chin were very coarse, just like a mans beard. Even when I removed it you could see hairs beneath the skin.
The Dr's prescirbed the Spironolactone and Birth Control Pills for it. Neither seemed to make a noticeable improvement. I went through electrolysis for about a year with little noticeable improvement. I even had the laser done once which seemed to work very well however I could not afford the follow up treatments and was about back where I started.
When Vaniqa came out I could not wait to see my Dr. He was very hesitant about prescribing it. He said it is not covered by insurance, is expensive and results are less than spectacular. I pleaded with him to prescribe it. You are not supposed to be able to see results for about a month but I did within a week or two. I have been on it for over a year now. My chin is completely hair free. I have probably found a grand total of 10 fine little hairs in the last year and just plucked them out. Now it hasn't worked as well on my upper lip for some reason. Hair still grows there but it is much finer and much slower. I have no problem waxing that about every other week.
I know the laser treatments are much much cheaper now than when I did it. I might do it again someday but now I am so much happier & more confidant and I don't have to hide my face anymore. I would urge you to try the Vaniqua.

I'm tickled to see this forum!

I also use Vaniqua and LOVE it!! My husband does too since I spend much less time in the mirror plucking my beard. :lol:

I told my mom about it and now she uses it too.

I saw quick results and stretched one tube out for 6 months. I found that putting it on right after washing my face or getting out of the shower while my skin is still warm helps a little go a long way. It probably helps it sink in good.

Jujubee or SolShine, does this work also for the fine blonde hairs?

I'm slow, Jennifer. Please forgive me!

We had a computer conversion at work (JUST SAY NO TO SAP!!!)

Yes, Vaniqua stops all hair growth where you use it. It won't get rid of what's already there, but nothing new will come when you are consistent with it.

I have thick dark hairs on my chin and neck and thick and thin white ones on my neck. When I use the Vaniqua I don't get any new one. I can tell when I stop though.

Yes, it will work on any hair. It won't remove the hair of course. You have to wax or pluck or whatever. Then use the creme.
It is expensive but a tube lasts me a couple of months. I use it on my entire chin and upper lip. If you don't have that much to cover it will of course last you a lot longer.

I don't quite understand what the glucophage does for the pcos.I have had pcos for a long time,diagnosed at 17 and now I am 34y/o.I do have the cysts on my ovaries,facial hair and weight gain,I had a hard time concieving but do have 2 healthy children.I don't know if I have insulin resistance,my fasting blood sugars are fine.I had a 5hr glucose tolerance test that was ok except low sugar at the end[52]a few years ago.I do get shaky and cranky if I don't eat every 5 hrs or so.I am not on any pcos medicine but in past took provera for irregular cycles,my cycles are more regular since my 2nd son was born 4 yrs ago[every 27-32 days]Are there different degrees of pcos because I don't think mine ias as bad as some of what I read.thanks

Hi Wendy, I replied on the other thread, but will paraphrase it here also incase you don't read the other thread. Glucophage will help lessen the symptoms in some women, and it will help prevent the onset of Diabetes, which PCOS'ers are at high risk for. It also helps some women lose weight, which is very important in Diabetes prevention and reduction of symptoms.