Weight Loss Surgery - Longterm dietary restrictions ... Sugar restrictions..More silly questions of mine =)




30and300
01-03-2010, 03:17 PM
First of all, thanks for this forum. I have found some good info here, and to be honest, it is a little overwhelming so please bear with me if I am asking something that is really common or silly, etc. =)

So I have been looking at surgeries since about mid Dec, and I am scheduled to see the doctor in February, so I haven't had the first consult yet. I have turned in the info & they agreed to set me up with a consultation. I want to be prepared before I go in.

I am currently comparing RNY and Lap band procedures. I am hoping to lose about 150 since I am so short. I don't have diabetes, high blood pressure or heart disease. My only medical issue is my back pain and my gall bladder attacks. I also take medication for anxiety, but that is improving.

My questions are specifically for RNY or Lap band:

1. I read a lot about hair loss. Is this something that can be avoided with proper vitamins? How much hair loss are we talking about? (is it noticeable?)

2. I read a lot about "dumping". I have semi-frequent gall bladder attacks (1-2/month). Chills, sweating, awful diarrhea and violent vomiting followed by nearly passing out from exhaustion from the vomiting and then sleeping for 10-12 hours solid. It's awful and the pain is extreme. How does this compare to dumping? I ask because the thought of having more of these episodes is really frightening to me.

3. When I was doing diets and such, I was told to never go below ~1100 calories a day because it would induce "starvation mode" and cause your body to consume your muscle instead of fat. Does this affect WLS patients at all?

4. I have also read about long term dietary limitations up to a point. I can't find too much info on life after say 5 years. Does a RNY mean you can never eat certain foods again in your lifetime? Or does it mean you are just restricted to how much of certain foods you can eat?

I ask because, and please don't hate me for this, but I enjoy cooking and eating with my family. I want to continue to eat with my family for holiday meals and birthday cakes. I cake give up 95% of my portions, but I want to still experience a taste of cake or a holiday cookie or a slice of thanksgiving turkey. I read about RNY being hard on the stomach's ability to digest processed foods and sugars and just want more info on this for the long term, say 5-10 years down the road.

Basically, bottom line is: does RNY mean you can never have a (very small) slice of birthday cake again? :?: Does your stomach completely reject all sugars?

And again, please, please don't yell at me for my silly questions. I am not asking if i can eat candy every day. I got fat by eating too much of EVERYTHING... lol. Mostly fast food and fried food, to be honest. But I hate the thought of giving up a whole food group forever. I do not have a sweet tooth at all, candy, ice cream and sweets have always given me a headache since I was a child. I eat sweets very sparsely (holidays, birthdays only) and much prefer the giant sandwich to anything sugary. I just want to know how it might work out.

But like i said, I am definitely ok with restricting how much I eat, but am not too keen on saying No to an entire type of food forever.

Thank you again for reading this huge post. :hug: I am truly sorry if my questions are ignorant or shallow, I am still reading up on all this stuff and I am just trying to find out the details. I plan to ask these questions to my doctor in Feb also. I just want to weigh my options (pun intended...) :^:


bloodroses
01-03-2010, 03:53 PM
i haven't lost any hair at all of course i had the vertical sleeve maybe try that one that way your still be able to eat anything you want but you have the restriction so just a thought. i'm down 84 pounds 89 more to go. Now i'm still thinking about the ds though because i don't know if this will be enough to keep me at goal but it hard to find out info on the ds itself myself. but the vertical sleeve could be a start for you. anyway good luck!:hug:

xoxo,
nikki

jillybean720
01-03-2010, 03:54 PM
1. I read a lot about hair loss. Is this something that can be avoided with proper vitamins? How much hair loss are we talking about? (is it noticeable?)
It's different for everyone and usually starts at about 3 months post-op. Most post-WLS hair loss is NOT caused by a deficiency, but rather by a natural process called telogen effluvium (this can happen after any major trauma to the body, including childbirth so it is not related specifically to WLS). Taking supplements such as biotin may help the new hair growing in to be healthier, but it will not prevent the hair from falling out. The loss is not permanent, as what is actually happening is that the old hair is falling out to make room for the new. The amount is different from person to person; mine was never visibly noticeable, just more hair in the shower drain on on my hairbrush for a while.

2. I read a lot about "dumping". I have semi-frequent gall bladder attacks (1-2/month). Chills, sweating, awful diarrhea and violent vomiting followed by nearly passing out from exhaustion from the vomiting and then sleeping for 10-12 hours solid. It's awful and the pain is extreme. How does this compare to dumping? I ask because the thought of having more of these episodes is really frightening to me.
I don't know about dumping since I did not have the RNY but I can tell you not all RNYers experience it, and some only have it for a short time after surgery, and then it goes away. I will say, though, that I hope you consult with your surgeon about removing your gall bladder during your WLS, as rapid weight loss will likely only worsen the state of your gall bladder.

3. When I was doing diets and such, I was told to never go below ~1100 calories a day because it would induce "starvation mode" and cause your body to consume your muscle instead of fat. Does this affect WLS patients at all?
Yes; this is part of why protein is so important post-WLS. You can't prevent some muscle from going, but since the body doesn't store protein (other than muscle), keeping a high supply of protein coming in daily through your diet will help to lessen muscle consumption. I have yet to find a surgery type where "protein first" is not one of the primary rules for post-op life.

4. I have also read about long term dietary limitations up to a point. I can't find too much info on life after say 5 years. Does a RNY mean you can never eat certain foods again in your lifetime? Or does it mean you are just restricted to how much of certain foods you can eat?
The RNYers I know might have trouble with a few certain foods, but after the first few months to a year, most of them can eat anything, just in moderation. I do know a few who have trouble with raw veggies long-term or with other certain foods, but, again, they are in the minority (of those I know, anyway).

Basically, bottom line is: does RNY mean you can never have a (very small) slice of birthday cake again? :?: Does your stomach completely reject all sugars?
Again, only about 30% of RNYers actually have dumping syndrome long term, so most can eat sugar. Those who do dump can usually still have a small amount, especially if they have something else with it instead of just sugar alone.

And again, please, please don't yell at me for my silly questions. I am not asking if i can eat candy every day. I got fat by eating too much of EVERYTHING... lol. Mostly fast food and fried food, to be honest. But I hate the thought of giving up a whole food group forever. I do not have a sweet tooth at all, candy, ice cream and sweets have always given me a headache since I was a child. I eat sweets very sparsely (holidays, birthdays only) and much prefer the giant sandwich to anything sugary. I just want to know how it might work out.
Based on these statements, I do hope you're also researching the DS, as it results in malabsorption of about 80% of the fat you eat. It does not cause dumping syndrome. So, if you like fatty foods as opposed to sweets, it may fit in better with your current lifestyle. Just a suggestion.


jiffypop
01-04-2010, 02:39 PM
30 - your Qs are EXCELLENT ones - and you NEVER need to apologize for asking them!!!

let's talk about the RNY for a bit. dumping is GENERALLY not as bad as your gall bladder attacks, but it's really an individual thing. as a rule of thumb, if you keep your carbs below 15 grams at a time, your dumping risk is LOW. BUT, as Jilly said, please be sure to discuss your gall bladder issues with your doc - many require those gall bladder pills [begin with a U] for a few months post-op.

now, about what you can eat or can't eat. after about a year [or a little more], you can pretty much eat everything. HOWEVER, we all have quirks, and they're different for everyone. roasted turkey and i ARE NOT good friends. and leftover white meat chicken is risky as well. cooked spinach isn't pretty for me, either. but i'm good with steak, and many other people are not. you'll learn over time, and you'll be OK with it.

i've eaten sandwiches, but frankly, i tend to pull them apart. just getting a bite out of them is often just way too much food for me to chew!!! and 1/2 sandwich is enough.

but these are things you'll learn. and most important, a little slice of B-day cake is OK. you CAN HAVE some treats, but ya gotta be careful. you knew that, though. i can tell you did.

Duckslove
01-04-2010, 04:17 PM
I'm only 2 months out from surgery, and I don't really have dumping(at least i don't think so) if I do it is pretty mild, light nausea if I eat something too sweet. the only foods I have a hard time with so far is broccoli, raw veggies and ground beef. the raw veggies I can eat a small amount of if i chew the crud out of it, but then my jaw hurts lol.
I'm going to echo everyone else and say, everyone reacts differently.

missangelaks
01-04-2010, 06:03 PM
1. I did lose quite a bit of hair. All I will say is, it grows back!

2. I did dump and I still do to some extent but it's not at ALL the same as the Gaul Bladder attacks I had before I had it removed! It feels like I have the flu for 2-3 hours after eating too much of something high in sugar or high in fat. I get nauseated, and may need to lie down for a while. Now, beings as far out as I am, I can and do eat things like cake. I try to limit how much and might choose a piece that doesn't have as much frosting etc. but I will have a bit or two. I don't miss it and I don't feel deprived. (really! even before surgery the fact is..the first bite is heaven, the second is fantastic, the third is good and after that you are just shoveling the food in...now I can stop at "good") I eat out, I cook for my boyfriend and family, I don't stick out at parties, I feel like the skinny girl that can only eat a little of things. "I just couldn't possibly" hehehe

3. I think Jill answered that question quite well. Eat Protein so your body doesn't have to get it from your muscles.

4. Eating well is the lock, Moderation is the key, and WSL is a great tool to keep them both working together. I treat myself well, with good food and exercise.

It's strange how much my tastes have changed. I used to eat soooo much sugar and fast food and the like before surgery. Now though, I see it for what it is, a nice treat now and then, something that will make me sick in excess, and really love the healthier choices...no really!

Great questions honey!! keep them coming!

Angela :hug:

nanj
01-05-2010, 03:50 PM
I'm a little over two years out and there are some things that bother me. But, first I have to tell you I'm a big bite taker and that gets me in trouble with just about everything that I eat. If I take small bites, take time and chew the darn stuff, instead of pigging it, I do pretty well. My bread has to be coarse and very thin, can't do more than 1/4 c. of whole grain pasta, but can do a bit of rice!! WTH! Sometimes I can eat chicken and sometimes I can't; gets stuck and I feel so MISERABLE!!! Sugary....is weird for me. If I get too much sugar, I get sweaty, clammy, shaky, nauseated and diarrhea; my "nether region" makes awful loud gurgly noises and I know at some point that me and my family will pay for it. GAS! Carbs and sugar alcohols will cause the worst smelly, loud GAS for me. It is embarrassing and awful. Then the old adage "Never trust a fart" becomes a problem. I can go for weeks and months and never have a problem, but it is always there and something I need to be mindful of. I always said at the beginning of my WLS journey that I would never, never, ever, eat things I'm not suppose too. Well, I have and I've paid dearly for it! I try very hard to stick to the 3/4 to 1 c. rule of food. And you can live with that. I eat five to six meals a day. But, one of those meals could just be a 1/2 c. of cottage cheese, or couple squares of cheese with some jalopena smoked sausage rounds, or five or six piece of thaw and serve shrimp with homemade cocktail sauce, or a can of olive oil tuna (tuna is another thing I have trouble with if water packed), or beef jerky, or a thin piece of spelt bread with PB&J on it. One of my favorite meals is 1 minute flax muffin toasted with SF peach butter. I ate 1/2 of baked potato with cottage cheese on it for supper the other night. I eat pizza once a week. If it isn't homemade than I eat one small slice and salad. I'm working hard to balance a carb with a protein to keep my blood sugar levels normal, because since surgery I do have to worry about my blood sugar going down and talk about shaky, fuzzy, weak feeling. I ate 8 peanut M&Ms and loved every minute of it....got a stupid stomach ache and had to drink a bunch of water to dilute the dumb stuff. Wasn't worth it. When I'm craving chocolate, I eat a tablespoon of Peanut Butter & Co. Dark Chocolate Dreams. Hair: I was dang near bald starting out at the beginning of the third month. Now my hair is full but wear it in a pixie cut because I like it. I don't really restrict myself from any foods that I really like, I just find a way to make them healthier. I love cheese crackers, but know I would try to gorge myself on a box of Cheez-Its, so I mound up a tablespoon of cheese on a cookie sheet and bake it in the oven....tada cheese cracker. You have to work after WLS, but the surgery will give you a chance. I had exhausted all of my chances over and over again, and WLS saved my life. Now I'm working everyday to keep my food addiction in check. BUT, I'M ALIVE!

kerbear879
01-07-2010, 08:52 AM
I'm coming up on my 5 year anniversary of RNY and so I'll try to answer your questions best I can..

1. I didn't start losing hair until about 6 months out and even then it just kinda thinned out and it grew back no problem. I don't really think there is a lot you can do to stop it. It really has to do with you losing weight so quickly but rest assured..it grows back!

2. Dumping will effect everyone differently and you aren't going to know how it will effect you until it happens. I never really had it happen to me until I ate chicken..and for some reason chicken never agreed with me for awhile. Also really greasy food doesn't like me either. And for me I would get really sweaty, clammy, and feel like I would pass out. The food that causes actually made me never want to eat it again and I don't miss it. I figured out early on what did it to me and so I basically just stay away from those foods.

3. Forget what you read about other diets...RNY is completely different and you will likely take a nutrition class to learn what nutrition requirements you will need. I only ate around 500 calories for a long time because that's all I could physically eat..they stress protein and it's really hard at first to get it in but everything gets easier through time.

4. Well I tend to tolerate sugar, which I guess I wish I didn't. I still can't eat gobs of it because I will feel miserable but I could eat a piece of birthday cake (a small piece) and be okay. But every person is different. To this day I still don't eat ice cream and I really don't eat hardly any sugar because I just don't care for it anymore. Once in awhile I get a sweet tooth but I still tend to eat low sugar stuff, that's just what happened to me..your tastes end up changing.

jiffypop
01-07-2010, 09:08 AM
I have to add one more point. there are a couple of foods that are IMPOSSIBLE for me to eat - and that's because they're not usually chewed: clams, oysters, mussels. and i love them. but think about it - these bivalves are generally just swallowed - now, imagine, something that's about an inch long trying to go through your outlet - which is about the size of a nickel. JUST DOESN'T WORK!!!

IMO, not eating these yummy items is well worth the price of better health. besides, i still get to enjoy lobster and crab occasionally, and that makes up for it.

sbinkerd1
01-10-2010, 06:06 PM
I had roux en y in 2001. I started at 411 pounds and dropped to 235. I recently noticed my pants feeling tighter and realized I had gained back to 248. That is why I am here.

Now I want to let you know about dumping. Early on it was horrible for me. The slightest amount of sugar would lay me out. I would be sick, cold sweats, dizzy, nausea. I would literally have to lay down for an hour before it would clear up. Then the gas and the diarrhea would kick in... UGH. I found out really quick not to eat anything with sugar in it. Now, 8 years out I can enjoy small bites of cake or pie or a piece of chocolate, but any more than that, and I could kill small animals with my gas.