Simply Filling/Core - Weekly Chat--october 12-18

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10-12-2009, 09:38 AM
Surprise! First time I've started the weekly chat in ages. Good morning, Chickies. I'm at DS's keeping the grands today. They're still asleep, so I have a little time here.

My plan for today is to enjoy the girls and stay op. Life is good. I hope you're all having a Magnificent Monday. I'll be back later.

10-12-2009, 10:38 AM
Good Morning Chicks! I just had my blood work done and am waiting until it's time to go see Jenny. I think I had a gain this week. There's no reason for it either....darn it.

Then I come home and eat lunch and go for my hair appointment. Then I'll have to come home for a nap since I was up until 2:15 this morning. I couldn't sleep. I was fretting. Sadly, I'm good at that.

beach bum
10-12-2009, 12:58 PM
Good Morning Ladies:)

I had a bad night and couldn't sleep last night,after hearing Leo hacking away. Stayed in bed until 7:30. Got on the scale and I stayed the same,luckily after having such stressful week.

SANDRA-Thanks for the new pages,Have a great time with your granddaughters.Spoke to one of mine on the phone yesterday,she told me all about her new pierced earrings and while my DD sent me a pix on the e-mail.She loves the color aqua and she had a matching outfit & nail polish to go with them.Oh to be young again.

VICKIE-Hope your blood work is fine and sending your [[[good vibes]]] for your W-I.

beach bum
10-12-2009, 01:04 PM
Originally Posted by mikahrae View Post
Hi everyone,

I am more wondering if I eat enough sometimes too. I am more wondering exactly what a portion size should be ?
if you are not measuring , how do you know ? Do you just eyeball and go with how your body feels ?

WELCOME to the chat MILAHRAE I'm the one that uses the black plastic frozen entree trays. I have a large 3 section one for dinner and the small 2 section for lunch or supper. I found them helpful in keeping my portions small. Now I just have to figure out how many calories my body needs to lose and I will be in business.

Bring this post up to the new week

10-12-2009, 02:03 PM
i gained .6. The JC counselor is kind of disgusted with me. She lowered my calories to 1500. I'll try.

10-12-2009, 02:25 PM
Good Morning:

Thanks for starting us Sandra.

Today is Thanksgiving here, as I mentioned. I enjoyed my evening with my godson and his family but am happy to have today to myself. The friend I'm staying with made a big pot of chicken-veggie soup before she left for the weekend, and I am really enjoying that. It, and chicken, will be my T Day lunch.

I went to a special spinning class this morning: turkey burn it was called. It went for one hour instead of 45 minutes and I spun off over 800 calories. WOW!

:welcome2: Mikahrae. WW says that a serving size of meat is about the size of a deck of playing cards. Fill your plate and tummy with veggies. You might find it helpful to use a food scale to figure out what 4 ounces of something looks like. The hardest part for me is realizing that I'm full and stopping, and that is the trick, if there is one.

Have a great day, all...BBL,

10-12-2009, 03:21 PM
Vickie, that upsets me about your JC counselor. She shouldn't get upset. You're doing well. Stress alone causes people to gain--and you're under a great deal of stress right now. I hope you get a good report from your bloodwork. Let us know what you find out.

Maryann, congratulations on maintaining. That's as good as a loss any time.

Rhonda, enjoy your holiday.

10-12-2009, 04:32 PM
Hi everyone -

I decided that I will try to put more focus on fruits and vegis .
Im not sure if this is a good thing but my goal for the day would be 8-10 vs 5 servings total .
I also decided that Im going to try to have starches in 3 of my 5-6 meals .
I think this will help :)

My meals this week :

1= strawberries with egg whites and picante sauce
2= about 2 cups of steamed veggies , grilled chix and teriyaki sauce 2 T (1 point)
3= split pea soup
4= fiber 1 with ff milk
5= ?


10-12-2009, 06:20 PM
Hey chicks! I started the first of my "fall break projects" today. I sanded and prepped my dining room table top for paint. I bought it this summer at Pier One. It had been 400.00 but had damage on the top, and I got it for 100.00. I am painting the top black and leaving the legs stained. I also bought 8 black chairs to go with it, so I'm really looking forward to seeing it all set up. Tomorrow I plan to get my exterior doors ready to paint. I'm also hoping to make my bed room drapes this week, so I have a lot to do. I have been op today and was op all day yesterday. That is a miracle right now. I also started a tally of wpa's for the week. I'm hoping to be worthy of the wagon when it passes through Tennessee.

Sandra, I hope you enjoyed your "girls" today.

Rhonda, happy Turkey day!

Maryann, I hope you get some rest tonight. I'm praying for Leo.

Vickie, how can a JC counselor show any negativity toward a client? I don't think that's good business! I think you are doing great. Don't let a decrease in calories get you down. You just do what you know is best for you, and she can either be nice or be quiet!!!!

Mikah, your plan sounds good. It will be trial and error for a while.

I'm off to my Monday night Bible study, so I've got to get off here. I hope you chicks have a great evening!!

10-12-2009, 06:42 PM
Micah, you go, girl. Sounds like a good plan for sure.

Sloan, I'm with you on the JC counselor. That's not right.

Enjoy your time off. Sounds like you're being productive.

I had fun with the girls today. Now I'm heading to the kitchen to make dinner. Life is good.

10-13-2009, 12:49 AM
[QUOTE=sloanie;2967488]Hey chicks! I started the first of my "fall break projects" today. I sanded and prepped my dining room table top for paint. I bought it this summer at Pier One. It had been 400.00 but had damage on the top, and I got it for 100.00. I am painting the top black and leaving the legs stained. I also bought 8 black chairs to go with it, so I'm really looking forward to seeing it all set up. Tomorrow I plan to get my exterior doors ready to paint. I'm also hoping to make my bed room drapes this week, so I have a lot to do. I have been op today and was op all day yesterday. That is a miracle right now. I also started a tally of wpa's for the week. I'm hoping to be worthy of the wagon when it passes through Tennessee.


I love that you are refinishing ! Thats a great bargain and I bet it will look very good !!!! Im not a good fixer-upper , but I might get better when I by my own house! Im saving for my down payment right now !

Do you redo alot of your own furniture ??

10-13-2009, 02:03 AM
Vickie...the others are right, and I like Sloan's comment...she can be nice or be quiet.

Nobody needs her "bad mother" routine. Tell her we said so!

I should be asleep; I have to be up :exercise: in the park in 5 hours?! I've been reading Three Cups of is a "must read".


10-13-2009, 09:20 AM
Thanks Chicks! You all are the best. I stuck to it yesterday but who knows. 200 calories down is a lot. I don't think that 1500 calories is enough for someone who weighs 272, but she is supposed to be the expert. I don't know if she is evaluated on whether or not people lose. I know she gets commission on the food sold.

If she keeps it up, I'll be back on WW sooner rather than later.

I'm going to try to walk today even though my hamstring is still a bit sore. Any website suggestions for gentle stretching exercises before walking on the treadmill. I can't do anything really heavy duty because of the hiatal hernia. I can't lift more than 15 pounds and am not supposed to be on the floor with situps or crunches or anything like that.

Talk to you all later.

10-13-2009, 11:37 AM
Mornin' chicks! I must admit that I am a little sore from the sanding project yesterday. I've already done my stretches and have a plan for the day. I'll spend an hour de-cluttering the family room (it has turned into the "catch all" room) then I will have to break down and work on some school work :( This afternoon when DH gets home, I plan to work on the table again and possibly remove the paint from the exterior door trim. Boy, was my Bible study last night convicting. Trust, trust, trust !!!!! I'm not always good at that:(

Vickie, look at the stretch on this site. It has lots of very good info on all sorts of muscle issues My DH has extremely tight hamstrings, and I was thinking he might have to use some kind of strap around his foot at first to help him reach. I think the directions say you can do the stretch in several different positions. I like this guy's philosophy of work opposing muscle groups at the same time. Let me know what you think. Also, you need to google some calorie calculators for weight loss. I looked at some, and I put in my stats with your weight (I'm 51 and 5'2"), and all of the calculators I looked at put the calorie needs for losing 2 pounds per week at over 2000 calories. I'm with you, I'm wondering if this chick gets compensated for her clients' weight loss.

Rhonda, my neice is reading the same book. I'm gonna check it out.

Mikah, I have refinished several pieces of furniture. It is not difficult but is time consuming. If you need some advice, let me know.

Sandra, I'm glad you had fun with your girls. Do they live very close to you and Curtis?

Maryann, I hope you and Leo are okay. You are usually on here pretty early. Is everything okay?

I've had an nsv. I've stayed on core for the last two days! It's been a long time since I have done that. Maybe I can do it again today! TTFN

10-13-2009, 03:01 PM
Rhonda, I just reread "A MENTAL MANAGEMENT SYSTEM: WITH WINNING IN MIND." I've read it about half a dozen times. Every time I read it I come away refreshed.

Sloan, the grands live about 8 miles from us. We had a great time yesterday.

Vickie, 200 cal less is a lot. I'm thinking you know your body better than she does. Do what you need to do.

I gained about a pound this week and earned every ounce. I'm still 1 pound ahead in my 1 per week goal. Life is good.

10-13-2009, 03:14 PM
Thanks Sloan and Sandra. Sloan I'm going to check out your suggestions. I'm SO hungry today and obsessed. I don't think that's good for me. I really let her throw me for a loop. I think I need to follow my instincts like you guys suggested.

I tried to exercise again today and it hurts again even with a slow walking warmup. I think I'll walk the subdivision tomorrow or Thursday. My Sister thinks it will be better for me than pounding on the treadmill.

Thank you all so much. I feel so supported here.

Off to make some applesauce.

10-13-2009, 05:18 PM
Hey Chicks. Jim and I have to go back to the Internist next week. Our cholesterol numbers showed almost no improvement despite 9 months of eating right and mega exercise for Jim. More worrisome is that my creatinine number only went down to 1.1 from 1.2. Sigh. I guess he'll want to discuss cholesterol medicine but I can't imagine that will be good for my kidneys. I guess I'll wait to hear what he says.

Aging stinks.

10-13-2009, 08:41 PM
Ditto, Vickie. I'm on meds now for cholesterol but hope to come off them in a few months.

beach bum
10-13-2009, 08:56 PM
Just wanted you to know that I will be off the thread for a while. Leo was taken into the hospital.He has a blood clot in in right lung along with the cancer and small amount of pneumonia on the top of the bad lung. Hes going to be in the hospital for 3 to 5 days. Depending on how the treatment of the 3 are working.

Need extra prayers

10-13-2009, 09:11 PM
Maryann, I'll be praying! Keep us posted and hang in there!

Vickie and Sandra, I'm on cholesterol, too! Every time I come off of them, my cholesterol goes up even though I am eating right :(

Hey to the rest of you chicks!

Night, night all!!!

10-13-2009, 11:26 PM
:hug: Maryann. I will say a prayer for Leo and for you, too.

Good night, Chickies.

10-14-2009, 10:18 AM
Oh Mary Ann, how scary for you and Leo. I will hold you both close in my prayers. Please let us know how you both are doing when you have a chance.

Thanks Sandra and Sloan. I guess I think Jim and I are the only ones to be on medicine. It's just that we have been SO awesomely good. I figured we'd be rewarded with low numbers. Do you all think the processed JC and Nutrisystem foods could negatively affect cholesterol levels? My Internist has no opinion; he says he's not versed on these programs. I'm going to ask him to send us to a nutrionist or something.

10-14-2009, 06:32 PM
Hey chicks, I've been workin' all day and have made a lot of progress in my catch all den. By tonight, I'll have it all decluttered and looking cozy!

Maryann, I'm still prayin'

Rhonda and Sandra, I'm reading an awesome book, too! It's called "The Help". I am loving it, so far.

I'm cooking supper and DH just walked in, so I've gtg. TTFN

10-14-2009, 06:47 PM
Hey chicks, I've been workin' all day and have made a lot of progress in my catch all den. By tonight, I'll have it all decluttered and looking cozy!

Maryann, I'm still prayin'

Rhonda and Sandra, I'm reading an awesome book, too! It's called "The Help". I am loving it, so far.

I'm cooking supper and DH just walked in, so I've gtg. TTFN

10-14-2009, 06:48 PM
sorry about the double post. I don't know how to make it go away :(

10-14-2009, 08:15 PM
Vickie, I don't know about the processed foods and cholesterol unless they are high in sodium.

I'm tired. Subbed today but am taking tomorrow off. I'll sub Friday.

10-14-2009, 09:59 PM
Maryann: I join the others in praying for you and Leo and hoping for the very best outcome for the two of you.

Vickie, the good news is that your internist admitted that he didn't know the programs. Insist upon seeing a nutritionist is my advice and opinion. MDs are not normally knowledgable about nutrition.

I've been exercising like a mad woman and I think it's paying off. My clothes get looser and looser. My friend doesn't have a scale and she told me not to bring one into the house! ;) I might have to do that anyway.

Have a great night everyone.


10-14-2009, 11:38 PM
Heya Everyone! New to this support group and to 3FC as well! I'm a 46 yr old mother of 2 boys. This is my second time in WW...last time I was in high school and wow have things changed! :p
I'm in my 12th week now. So far it's been going really well. One thing I've been lax in is counting points. I do journal everything I eat...but I got kinda tired of having to figure out pts. I've been losing okay each we'll see how long I can get away with it. LoL

You seem like a wonderful group...and I look forward to getting to know you all :)

10-15-2009, 12:10 AM
:welcome: TLC.

Rhonda, do you have scales where you go for spinning?

I'm exhausted tonight and my feet are really aching. Sorry to be complaining but I'm just not feeling well.

10-15-2009, 01:18 AM

Glad to meet you...Everyone here is very supportive....

Question... A lot of the core recipes have corn meal in them.
Is that core or do I add points for it??

I have been at the hospital with my Aunt for 2 days and it is really hard to do Core there, especially when the cafeteria is closed. I had to just do the best I could.

10-15-2009, 07:54 AM
Nancy, corn meal is core. It's great in recipes.

10-15-2009, 08:33 PM
Hey chicks, busy day today! Breakfast with my parents, work on the house, then went with niece for foot surgery, now I am finally settled for the evening. My DS and DH just ran out, so I'm alone for now. It's nice to have some quiet!

Maryann, I'm still prayin' for Leo.

Hey to the rest of you chickies! Have a nice evening :D

10-16-2009, 10:13 AM
Good Morning Chicks! This morning I'll be exercising and getting ready for the TV repairman to come. We have a Sony big screen that feels like it's always broken lately. Good thing we have an extended warranty until April 2011!

Then I'll be shopping at Carson's this afternoon. I couldn't find any good choices at my favorite stores yesterday. I hope I can fit into their 3X. Sometimes they've run small in the past.

Hope you are all well, exercising and drinking your water. My scale is up this morning after my restaurant meal. Sigh. I'm trying to stick to 1500 as many days as I can.

10-16-2009, 03:17 PM
:welcome2: TLC!

We are very supportive and informative group...join in.

I bought some scales and we'll see if my friend pitches them out! :lol:

I have lost a few more pounds but not as many as I'd hoped. But, I'll tell you for sure that my body is changing shape, in a good way. The exercise is good.

I'm having a rough week at work, but what else is new? It's in the job description!

I'm enjoying staying with my friend. She runs a day care and one of the little boys who told me that he is "two and a lot" has a big crush on me. And, vice versa. Sandra, don't tell my DH; he might get jealous :rofl:

My eating has been good. I did just have a sandwich, but it was a healthy one! I still need more protein I think.


10-16-2009, 04:28 PM
Rhonda, I think you're an awesomely funny chick! Congratulations on the pounds. The weight loss is going slow for me too.

10-16-2009, 07:23 PM
Hey chicks, I've had another busy day. I,too, am having scale issues, but I'm the one who wants to throw them out. Do I remember that Paula was having issues with keeping scales in the bathroom? Paula, what have you done? Are you keeping your scales somewhere else? Did you buy a new scale or just move yours to another place. I have a new scale, but it already is acting crazy. I can get on and off three or four times in a row, and the weight is different each time. Since I don't like what it is saying I'm even more frustrated.

Rhonda, from now on when someone asks me how old I am, I am going to say "fifty and a lot". I love that! I am, as always, impressed with your dedication to exercise. Way to go :carrot:

Vickie, did you look at those calorie calculators I told you about? I'm really concerned that you aren't eating enough, and that your metabolism might slow down. I hope you are doing okay!

Welcome TLC !

GTG get some supper for my DH. TTFN

10-16-2009, 09:09 PM
Sloan, my DH says that he is "29 plus tax" and the tax rate is killing him.

I'm going to bed early tonight, Chickies. We have a 7AM :exercise: class in the morning, in the park. The temperature is predicted to be above freezing, so let's hope so.

Good night :yawn:


10-16-2009, 09:51 PM
Rhonda, I love your sense of humor. And congratulations on your successes. You're looking great. Now get some rest this weekend.

Vickie, did you find some new clothes?

My weightloss is going slowly, too. I am down about 9 pounds now, but I don't think I'm going to lose a pound this week. (and I know why)

10-16-2009, 11:35 PM
Frustrated tonight with housework and the lack of help I get
with cooking/laundry/cleaning/errands/bills and all the other million things
to do .. Our family will go without milk for a week instead of someone else
picking any up.

I can never come up with a cleaning schedule that works. Hubby says he will
vacuum weekly for me but forgets unless I remind him 20 times.

Tonight ..Hubby asked me if I wanted help folding laundry (after I hinted)and I snapped "I wouldn't want you to miss a show!!"
and everyone thought I was a nice person....:devil:

Good news is that my weight is down 3 pounds and back to the weight I have posted on my tracker (I could not bare to move it up when I
gained those 3 pounds) So now I am really at 139..not just pretending to be :carrot:

10-17-2009, 10:00 AM
Ah Nancy, we've all been there. Good luck with that!

Congrats on the 3 pounds lost.

I've been to :exercise: and today includes visiting some friends and continuing to sort out STUFF!

Have a great day everyone.


10-17-2009, 02:38 PM
Thanks Sloan. I only got to check one website and it said 1800! I'm not sure I trust the website I chose so I need to do some more searching for reliable sites. I'd be interested if you have a calorie counting one that you trust. I recalculated my WW points last night. I'd get 31 points. I'd always heard that the value of a point is 50 calories. That would put me at 1550 for a minimum plus up to another 250 calories a day if I divided the 35 WPA's out over the week. So that would be 1550 to 1800 a day. Close to what that other calculator said. If that's true, I don't know why I stopped losing at the 1700 mark. That was why she lowered me to 1500 calories. I'm agreeing that it too low for me.

Congratulations Nancy! Job well done.

I've got a birthday party tonight. I'm bringing my food with me because it's at my Sister's house. Have a great day everyone!

10-17-2009, 02:39 PM
Sandra, I didn't get to Carsons yet. I have to go tomorrow. I ran out of time because the TV repairman came to late. I'm going tomorrow after I walk on the treadmill.

What does everyone have planned for the weekend?

10-17-2009, 05:02 PM
Well, here's what I'm doing for the weekend.

I've been to lunch in Chinatown with a friend (never mind what I ate!). Tonight I'm doing nothing but sorting through stuff.

Tomorrow is :ebike: more spinning, then visiting with former MIL and then more nothing...if I'm lucky.

This upcoming week is going to be very tough. Some governance committees are considering the fate of the unit I head and I expect student-led protests. Look for us on the news :lol:

Stay on program everybody! (that means don't eat Chinese food!)


10-17-2009, 08:47 PM
Hey chicks, how does pistachio nuts and blush wine compare with chinese food?

Rhonda, I really need help!! If I only ate chinese food I'd be doing well :D Oh, I love "29 and tax" that's a good one, too!

Vickie, I'm so proud to hear about you taking your own food to the party. I'm going to a birthday party tomorrow and will not be taking my food :devil:
I did look at Mayo Clinic's site. They say you need to cut 500 calories from your daily intake to lose a pound a week. If you use their calorie calculator to determine how many calories you need to maintain then subtract 500, that should put you in the ballpark. I would trust that site, since Mayo has such a good reputation.

Nancy, 139 is awesome! I've gained a couple of pounds and want to get back to 128 before Christmas. Also, I have the answer to the cleaning issue: live in a mess! If nobody else cares, then you should just relax! Do some things that you enjoy and pace yourself on the cleaning. Do you have a lot of drop in guests? Just keep the living room clean and don't worry about the rest. If that doesn't work then there is a book I can recommend. It is called Get Your Act Together, and it is by the Slob Sisters. It has some good ideas and will make you laugh.

I'm so tired from house organizing and projects, but I've got to work on the dreaded "layered curriculum" for next week. Wish me luck! TTFN

10-18-2009, 12:42 AM
Nancy, been there done that. Hang in there. And :woohoo: on losing those 3 lbs!

Rhonda, I wish you the best for the coming week. Sounds stressful.

Sloan, what is layered curriculum? Sometimes I think education needs to return to its roots. But what do I know? I do know that 8th graders I had in math the other day didn't know their multiplication facts--and they also didn't know how to act in class. (Am I sounding old?)

Night night.

10-18-2009, 11:12 AM
Rhonda, I'll be watching! Good for you for staying so active. That will help with the chinese food. I ate chines at the party too. JC Wok Beef. It's actually pretty darned good. I ate a can of wax beans and some homemade applesauce with it. Then I splurged with a JC pumpkin spice cake for dessert. Are you almost done packing? If they end your program does that mean you can go to Texas sooner?

Sandra, how are you doing with your eating and exercise? I'd think that working again might get in the way.

Sloan, I should have thought of Mayo. I went to the calculator and it says 2050 calories for me to maintain. So 1550 to lose 1 pound a week. It just seems so low. It's also exactly what WW said as my minimum. It doesn't explain what would happen if I ate the equivalent of the 35 points which would be the extra 250 per day. I guess that means I'd only lose .6 a week. This is all very interesting to me. The answer may be to get even more active if I want to eat more.


10-18-2009, 11:47 AM
Vickie, I've been eating my WAPs this week and my weight is up a pound. I don't have official wi till Tuesday so I'm hoping it will go down. I do get hungry sometimes when I keep within my 24 pts. It's almost like my body's fighting me wanting to stay big. Sounds crazy, doesn't it?

Subbing does help. I have been snacking too much in the evening this week using WAPs. I need to stop that.

We're heading to church in a bit then I'm guessing we'll mow the yard. We've had over a foot of rain in recent weeks and everything's growing like mad. Well, everything's growing but my roses. I should have planted something that can handle so much rain and humidity better. Life goes on.

10-18-2009, 03:48 PM

A pound of fat is 3500 calories, so, as was said, you have to get rid of 500 calories a day to lose one pound a week. I can't believe with all the execise I'm doing that my loss is slower than that. But, I am developing muscle and reshaping.

Vickie, I'm afraid the answer must be to eat less and get more active :cry:

No, I don't get to leave earlier. The transfer of the program won't happen until Jan. 1.

I'm going to take a nap :yawn:


beach bum
10-18-2009, 04:19 PM
Hi Ladies

Since my last post,Leo was taken to Beth Israel Hospital in Boston[Farr Bldg]where they took almost a pint of water from his lung and then they put a filter into his left groin area to prevent future blood clots.They were also going to put a stint near his bronchial tube to make it easier to breath as the cancer moved surrounding the bronchial, but it was too far so they decided to give him oxygen instead.

Got home from the hospital last night and now the visiting nurses are going to be here once in the morning and once in the evening. They are going to bring some nurses in for personal care bathing and dressing also.

My DD & DS came from NY to stay with me but we decided to go up to see him and stay in a hotel in Boston for the remainder of his hospital stay.

So now that my DD & SD are gone, its up to me to be a nurse to my darling Leo,The VN was so kind and asked if I have relatives that could help me,but I told her unfortunately I don't I only have a small group of friends and One already called and ask why I wasn't in church 2 Sundays in a row and I explained and she is going to help me with the groceries & errands.

I learned how to give the injections and how to master the oxygen. Along with the meds and all the other nine yards.

That all for now, will keep you informed,but won't be able to post daily.

Thanks again for being there for me,

10-18-2009, 04:34 PM
Mary Ann, prayers are with you.

10-18-2009, 06:06 PM
Dear, dear Maryann. I am so sorry to hear that Leo is having to suffer this. You will be a good nurse, don't worry. If you find it all too taxing, don't resist asking for more help from both professionals and friends.

I can remember when my dear and late DH was suffering so I was shocked at how helpless friends were at times. Sometimes you just want your laundry and grocery shopping done for you!

We will all be thinking of you and praying for you and Leo.


10-18-2009, 08:00 PM
Rhonda, I'm willing to accept that but not easily.

10-19-2009, 12:14 AM
Maryann, when friends ask what they can do to help you, be ready with an answer. They really want to do something, so let them! I wish we were all closer to you and could help out. Please keep us posted and know that we are praying for you and Leo.

Sandra, layered curriculum is simply listing assignments with point values and allowing the students to choose and plan their assignments to work toward the highest grade possible. Lecture and hands on experience are still included, it just makes the students more responsible for their work and the material. There are less tests and more oral defense of assignments (which the students hate 'cause they actually have to know the material instead of cramming for a test). It is a lot of work for me, but I really believe the students need to be more responsible for their learning. If you want more info, you can look at

My DH just got in from East Tennessee, so I gtg visit.