20-Somethings - Interracial dating?

Why is it such a big deal? I love who I love. My Mom made it clear to me this morning that she does not agree with it. I've been single since I moved back to Canada from Jamaica. and obviously my boyfriend was black. My Mom was snooping through pictures today and was like "Is this your boyfriend?" I said he WAS my boyfriend, then she goes on to say how she doesn't agree with black and white relationships. Thats not like her at all. Shes very friendly and non-judgemental?... What if the man I marry is black? I'm so confused. :?:

i'm a mom. I"m not racist. i have friends of all races, all sexes, all ages, and all religions and political persuasions.

I am "white" my daughter prefers "black" boys. she is 16. we told her WE are ok with it (her grandparents were not too happy when her daddy fell in love with a jewish girl what will they do with a black grand-son in law) BUT that society as a whole still in 2008 is NOT happy about it.

she found a boy she likes. He likes her. he went home and told his mom he met a girl. her first question "is she white (he's black)" yeah she is. his mom said "you can't date her" he's as confused as she is. I get it.

A lot of it has to do with generational issues, and ignorance. I know a lot of "older" people who have nothing against people of other races, but frown on interracial relationships (I know, it really doesn't make sense). I asked about it once and the answer I was given was based off of mistreatments and prejudices that that person witnessed growing up. She told me that she felt awful about kids who she saw in school, who were the product of interracial relationships. They were shunned and made outcasts. I tried to explain that the world isn't like that as much anymore. People of mixed nationality or race are now often viewed as exotic and beautiful looking. But bad experiences can scar someone.

I am IN NO WAY defending it, nor do I understand it. What does the color of someone's skin have anything at all to do with who they are as a person? I'm just giving you another perspective.

I wish my Mom was as cool as you then. I seriously only find myself attracted to 'dark' men. I don't know why, it's always been that way. I tryed to date a man the same race as me, but it didn't work out. Nothing in common, music, style, etc. I just wonder if I did marry outside my race, if my Mom would disown me. My Dad is perfectly okay with it, he said as long as I'm happy he doesn't care if he's white, black, purple or green:). I wish I knew someone who went through this with a parent, so I could take some advice!.

That's too bad about your Daughter's bf's Mom. Hopefully she can look past the skin colour.

First of all realize that you were born in a different era then your Mom. It used to be a bigger deal to people then it is now. Maybe she doesn't realize that times have changed? I know some people don't like it because they think your life is harder in an interracial relationship; harder due to outside forces and harder for children of said couples. I don't believe this to be true in most areas anymore. I'm sure there are areas where it could be a problem, but those areas are shrinking as our culture becomes more progressive.

My BIL is black and he's a great guy and wonderful husband for my sister. My niece is the cutest 5 year old I know (I'm biased.) They live in city that is very open and they have no problems in that regard. I don't think it matters who you love. I don't think race, sex, religion, etc. matter as long as you are happy.

Maybe you should talk to your Mom and ask why this bothers her? If it's for societal reasons, then maybe there is a way to show her that it's not an issue these days.

BUT that society as a whole still in 2008 is NOT happy about it.


I guess it depends on where you live. I don't think society is so against it anymore.

Maybe you should talk to your Mom and ask why this bothers her? If it's for societal reasons, then maybe there is a way to show her that it's not an issue these days.

Good idea. I think I might if she brings it up again.

Thanks for your input everyone.

smart parents get over themselves if their kids are happy and learn to deal if not actually like the inlaw children they originally did not approve of. and years later will regret missing the wedding. take good pictures.

Honestly, I was in an interracial lesbian relationship for two years and no one ever really gave us a hard time. The whole parental "I'm not racist, it's society" is a smoke screen, for the most part. They may not be overtly racist, but it's hard to get out a lot the things that are taught to you as a child and so they end up feeling mildly uncomfortable about it. If you live in back woods Mississippi then maybe it's a legit issue, but any reasonable sized city and you should be fine. Especially as a straight couple.

In the UK, my part of it anyway, part of the 'difficulty' is that inter-racial is also inter-cultural and inter-faith. You can bet your bottom dollar/euro/pound that (again talking about my part of the world) the guys from another race who're dating white girls don't even dare tell their parents about it. Sadly, most of the girls who get involved this way are good for one thing only, until the proper marriage is arranged.

I don't believe I'm racist - although I get tired, sometimes, of being an ethnic minority in my own country - and think black men are hugely sexy, I don't find life as black and white (sorry for the pun) as I used to. Sure a person is a person is a person. Sure we love whom we love - but love can sometimes be too blind, not to colour but to cultural expectations of a relationship.

And just to add, because I know that posting can sound colder than it's meant to, when I said above that life isn't as black and white as it used to be for me, I'm In No Way implying anyone else is being simplistic in their beliefs!!!!! Just, my own experience has altered my views considerably.

My parents always raised us to believe that everyone was equal -- they had black friends and had a black foster child for four years. However, when my first boyfriend was black my mom was uncomfortable with it. This was in 1982, so it was a while ago. No one really ever hassled us, but we did live in El Paso Texas, which has Fort Bliss (hence more mixed race relationships) and is on the border.

I think there are very few people who are truly color blind in every way.

i have never come across this issue....
i dont think my parents would make much of a deal out of it tho if it wer to happen....

Heh, I think it's funny because I've always been blind to race and I don't agree with Wife2abadge that there are 'very few people who are truly color blind." (That said, she makes a point, there are probably A LOT of people who aren't color blind completely, but some do exist, and I know a lot of them fortunately).

Mainly where I live, it's black and whites, although I've recently made friends with a laotian guy. So, I've always had a lot of black friends, much to the chagrin of the backwards hicks I went to school with. My mother wasn't too happy, she was raised a certain way and she couldn't STAND my bestest bestest friend from school, who was a black girl.

Now, fast forward in time, my mom is in her 2nd interracial relationship with a black man, and she said she 'ain't never going back'! I'm thrilled. My grandparents aren't. I am happy that she's embraced other races.

I am with a white man. But before him, I was with a man who was half hispanic, half white. And if a man is attractive, then he's attractive. I don't care if he's white, black, hispanic, etc etc etc, if a MAN IS ATTRACTIVE THAN HE IS ATTRACTIVE. I briefly dated a black/native american guy when I was 18 and he was beautiful. Of course, I've also dated plenty of white guys, and I am with a white guy now like I said. It doesn't matter to me, who I like, is who I like.

My best friend- not the one from school, but my best friend now- (that is not to say my other friend is not still a best friend, but she lives hours away now)- is a white girl. She used to date white guys and her parents are racist as ****, especially her father. She started dating black guys when we were 19 and hasn't gone back since. She doesn't want to date white guys any longer. Her current boyfriend is an awesome guy. As a matter of fact, I've known him way longer than she has, he's been a best friend of mine for years. I think it's great that despite the racist attitude in this little southern county, they don't care, all they care about is that they love eachother. She is getting an immense amount of pressure from her family about it and she still is with him. They claim that he is using her just because she's a white girl and he's a black guy. They claim he is this, and that. And it's all because of the color of his skin. That is ridiculous. I've known him way longer than any of them and he is a truly decent human being, unlike my friend's parents, and he loves my best friend. He calls me JUST to talk about her and how angry he is about the way her family treats her and uses her (they always hit her up for money and don't pay it back.) His voice actually raises with emotion, anger, and concern... He is not using her. He blatantly is in love with her. 'nuff said.


My boyfriend is a southerner (I am from the north) and his family uses that dreaded word... you all know what word I mean. And he never has. He and I actually met through a mutual friend, a black guy. And he is truly color blind. A lot of his friends are black and he has befriended all of the hispanic neighbors although the white people don't associate with them. My BF has the ability to befriend anybody. Plus, his idol is 2pac.

Anyway, I am color blind, my bf is colorblind (if he was the typical redneck guy around here, I could not be with him, I can't be with someone who is a racist), my mom is now colorblind, my best friend is colorblind... I enjoy the company of other races all of the time. I would love to know more hispanic, native american, and asian people, and recently became friends with an asian guy and we love talking about authentic asian foods...

I just CANNOT understand racism. I can't understand the thought process behind it, I can't understand the mentality, the feelings, the logic... JUST CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT!!! Even if someone's been raised like that, I still just can't understand it. I was born in Long Island and there were only whites in that neighborhood where we lived. At school, there were two japanese twins who became my good friends. They were the first asians I recall seeing. I never saw a black person to my recollection until I moved to NC and my parents were racist. While my dad claims he is not, he still is without realizing it and they taught us to have the same attitude. In school in NC there were whites and blacks and mostly they were segregated from eachother. I somehow became friends with them and I've never had a racist attitude since.

I believe you CAN overcome how you were raised. My grandparents do not use the "n" word but they do make racial comments and they were not pleased at all to find out about my mother dating black guys. But despite this, my mother has overcome how she was raised when she found love with a black man, and now another black man. It CAN happen. Using how you were raised as an excuse is simply that, an excuse to remain being comfortable in racism.

Oh man..
My boyfriend is "white" - born in Spain, grew up here.. family is Italian and Spanish..
My family is from Bangladesh, I was born here..
My mom is the same exact way.. I've been going out with my bf for about 3 1/2 years and once she found out about him, we went through a ton of drama.. She is in the mindset of two families getting married together, not just two people and she wanted that from me.. since all of her family is in BD and it's lonesome over here, she expected me to find a bengali boyfriend whose family would then become her family..
Ugh.. a lot of drama.. I don't agree with her because I love him regardless of race and I was brought up in a diverse part of NJ.. My mom doesn't have very many friends either so she can get judgmental at times and well it's tough. :hug: I know exactly how you feel!

I don't believe I'm racist - although I get tired, sometimes, of being an ethnic minority in my own country

How do you think the actual minorities who get discriminated against feel? Somehow I bet it's still a lot easier to be white. ;)

But I guess it is "your" country too.

Thanks ladies - Sometimes I think it would be easier if I would just start dating "white" men. Like I said, I've tried and tried, I can't. And I'm fully aware that relationships are hard, but add the interracial difference, and it's 10 times harder. My bestfriend is white, and she to likes black men. She said once you have an interracial baby and your Mom holds it, all her "racist" thoughts would go away.
My Mom isn't racist, which is the weird thing, my parents good friends are black. But I guess she hates the idea of me being with a black man. "secret racism" if you will.
I may happen to fall in love with a white man some day, who knows.
I've noticed when you tell a white man you dated a black man, they get all weird and intimidated.
I quote "Once you go black, we don't want you back". That's what my ex said to me.
I wanted to punch him.

Yup, secret racism. People like that will be good friends with other races, but the thought of having ... relations.... with them disturbs them, and that is because, no matter how many friends of other races that they have, they are still racist inside.

And I also agree that when you tell a white man you've dated a black man, they get all weirded out and stuff. My mom said most of her white male admirers are disgusted that she is with a black man and wouldn't touch her with a 10 foot pole now. That's just wrong! My BF doesn't care if I was with someone black, purple, blue, magenta! I'm with him now.

This is interesting.

I'm a black woman and I've dated my share of the rainbow but mainly white men. After all the stares, whispers, and insults, I've learned to ignore what other people think and do me which is to date who I want. I'm single right now but I know when I get into my next relationship, whoever it is, I don't care about what others will say to me, what they think about me. Its just about me and him. And my family, they don't agree but they don't live for me, I live for myelf.

How do you think the actual minorities who get discriminated against feel? Somehow I bet it's still a lot easier to be white. ;)

But I guess it is "your" country too.

I know what you're saying but I can't think of a way to respond that isn't getting way too deep into politics!

Nope, I've started a sentence 3 times but can't get out what I want to say in a way that doesn't need huge long explanations. I suppose it depends on what you mean by 'easier' - when my place of worship has been vandalized and I've been spat at and had bottles smashed into my front garden because I'm white, it's tough to be told by the authorities that it's not racism because England is predominantly white.

It's the difference between statistics and real life, I guess! Statistically, in England people other than white people are more likely to be discriminated against - and discrimination is wrong, wrong, wrong; but when it's happening to me, it's no less wrong cos I'm white.

When my younger sister was 16, she dated a black guy. When my parents and I absolutely hated him, she blamed it on him being black. Well, we hated him because he lead the rude, ignorant (for lack of a better word) "gang banger" lifestyle. He was incredibly rude and disrepectful to her, her family, and pretty much everyone else. At one point, he stopped in the dairy queen she was working at, asked to borrow her keys to get a cd out of her car, and was later pulled over in her car going 85 down a back country road. My parents did everything to keep him away from her, and she always thought it was because he was black. She realizes now it was because he was a piece of crap.

So this leads me to my point. It is unfortunate that black people are linked to this lifestyle, but it is kind of a fair assumption. There are plenty of white people that live this lifestyle too, and I hate them just as much as the black people that do it, and the purple people, and the green people. My hatred and annoyance for this lifestyle is colorblind.

It affects my everyday life. A few months ago, a group of kids, for no good reason, broke the window out of my car as it was parked on the street. The sidewalk in front of my house is a common gathering place for these "groups". They yell profanity at all hours of the night, and leave beer bottles and cigarette butts in my bushes. Every time we walk past them they have a derogatory remark. They call my boyfriend a "******" because he has long hair. Last week I cut my foot on a glass I broke in my kitchen, and I walked past them later that day and I was kind of limping, and one of them said to another "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!". One time, I was in a store with some friends, and while in line to pay there were three of them (and one of them was white, keep in mind, so when I say "them", I don't mean black people, I mean "ghetto" people, for lack of a better word) and they were saying swear words and talking in a disrepectful way, and they crumbled up a cookie and put it in my friends hair, for no good reason.

I work in a low cost spay and neuter clinic in a neighborhood that isn't the greatest. A lot of poverty stricken ghetto people come there, and they are completely disrepectful of us and their animals. I've been called every name possible. And they are inappropriate even when they don't mean to be. I mean, they will call for information, and just the language they use sometimes floors me. Like, one time, a lady called because she thought her cat was in heat, and she said to me, "she keeps sticking her **** up in the air". That is not how you word things when on the phone with a business, inquiring about services.

I am not racist. I know that everyone is probably going to read this and jump down my throat, but it is my opinion, and I think I have the right to express it. There is a guy that I used to work with, who is black, who had the exact same opinion as me. And he was one of the most intelligent, nicest people I ever met.

And the whole "rap" lifestyle that goes in hand with it is just as bad, and maybe even the cause for their behavior. The music (if you can call it that) glorifies sexism, drugs and disrespect. It's awful.

So, my whole point is, maybe when your mother said she didn't want you to date someone black she was wrongfully assuming you were going to date one of these complete wastes of a beating heart. Maybe if you can explain to her that it's not the skin color that makes them behave this way, and your boyfriend is a normal, respectful person. (That's assuming that he is, but if he isn't, and he is one of these "ghetto" people, you shouldn't date him, and neither should any other self respecting woman, white or black.)

For those who hate the "rap" lifestyle. They have no one but white people to thank. White people put out the blacksplotation movies of the 70's (Tupac's mom has done a lot of interviews about how much he loved those movies). And that's where most of the "rap culture" stems from.

They sent the clear message that for black people to survive the movie they had to be a drug dealer, a pimp or both. And then people wonder how this stuff starts. :dizzy:

It's just an easier way to be racist. Thinking that "they" just "choose" to be that way. No, it was sold to them by those in power.

Women are sold the exact same BS about how we should be skinny, blonde and submissive, but somehow that's all blamed on the media.

I'm in an interracial relationship as well (my boyfriend is half korean, with a VERY korean mother), and ya know what? The thought didn't even occur to me until my mom pointed it out. I knew she was fine with it because she had almost married a black man years before I was born.

Some people aren't okay with it...my bf's mom, for example. She lovvvvvvved me until she realized that bf and I were really getting serious (we've been together 3 years at this point), and now she tells bf that she wishes he'd date Korean girls and that she's disappointed that I'm white.... now, mind you, bf's father (her ex-husband) is white. Soooooooooo how exactly did she get up on this high horse? I don't know. I can't stand it, though.

Basically, to quote a musical (as I so frequently do!) "you just have to love who you love". I'm not limited by race, faith, or anything else. It's so frustrating when people don't approve, but at the same point, it's not their decision, it's mine. I've found an supportive, sweet, kind, and loyal guy who treats me amazingly. WHO CARESSSSSSSS WHAT COLOR HIS SKIN IS?!!?!??!?

With my parents it was because they were old when they had me. So the culture they grew up in was segregated.

I married a man that was 1/4 Native American, and my dad was extremely upset with me because I didn't marry a "white" man. He said people would call me a squaw!

[/QUOTE]And the whole "rap" lifestyle that goes in hand with it is just as bad, and maybe even the cause for their behavior. The music (if you can call it that) glorifies sexism, drugs and disrespect. It's awful.

So, my whole point is, maybe when your mother said she didn't want you to date someone black she was wrongfully assuming you were going to date one of these complete wastes of a beating heart. Maybe if you can explain to her that it's not the skin color that makes them behave this way, and your boyfriend is a normal, respectful person. (That's assuming that he is, but if he isn't, and he is one of these "ghetto" people, you shouldn't date him, and neither should any other self respecting woman, white or black.)[/QUOTE]



Sooo.... theres some rap that glorifies sexism, drugs and disrespect. Look in your little CD collection and describe just the *covers* of the CD's of half your little rock bands and tell me again about music being the influence of drug use, misogyny, and disrespectful behavior. It's more of an environmental influence hun, not some idiot in excessive jewelry talking about his life on the streets. Even the most "ghetto" know the music is for entertainment and are also fully aware of the fact that most of those guys are exaggerating about their experiences quite a bit. When do you even hear gangster rap anymore anyway? 99% of the rap songs i've heard in the last 8 years have been about drinking, going to the club, and watching some strippers. Last I checked, that's all most rocks bands and even quite a bit of country musicians sing about as well. That's just MEN running their mouths. It's not one style of music, but it's the only one you dislike, so it's the only one you mention.



Now as for the original post -- I'm obviously a child of mixed ethnicities and i've even got a little half-brother and my stepdad and mom have been married for 21 years. My mother is black and my dad is white (Creole, and Berber respectively), and even growing up in Kansas it was really never much of an issue. All of the attention I got from it was positive, even if it was annoying. There was always someone touching my face and commenting on my "cafe au lait" complexion, or running their hands through my hair because they loved my curls, or they had never seen light brown eyes before.

Now that i'm big enough to smack at them if they start grabbing at me, that wonder has shifted into the ever-present innocently confused stares, and that ONE courageous person who finally speaks up for the group and asks very politely, "Excuse me, but we were talking about you and we wanted to know... um... what are you?"

Every relationship i've ever been in was an interracial one, and you know what? WHO CARES! Love your mother, but also know that she loves you. She will not disown you for dating and marrying a black man, though it may take her a while to warm up to it. The point is, she will get over it. And regardless of whatever her stance is, it wouldn't matter if your children came out half Martian, once she found out she was a grandma she would love those children no matter what. Let somebody else say they don't believe in interracial coupling after that and see how she reacts! You know this in your heart, and that's why her saying it is bothering you so much. The words hurt, but you know it's all just a bunch of hot air. Im proof that being mixed has it's advantages. As a kid it was kind of lonely having everyone always point out how you're different, but it also becomes your strength. If you don't fit in, then you stand out. That means you can go anywhere and be noticed, so you've always got the advantage in any situation. Everyone remembers you.

I ended up marrying a guy whose family is second generation American with strong German roots. He made the mistake of not preparing them for me, and so when we got off the plane our first Christmas visiting them (and our first time meeting) you can imagine the looks on their faces. They were incredibly nice while I was there though, and nobody wanted to be rude and ask me the infamous "what are you?" question. I believe they had tried to ask my husband, but he gave them some smart quip like, 'human' or something. We went to a Mexican restaurant and two waiters were laughing and discussing something in Spanish with some other patrons while we were sitting down waiting. His dad actually leaned over to me at one point and asked, "What are they saying?" There was this audible gasp from the whole family, and my husband looked like he wanted to knock him out. I, on the other hand, had never laughed so hard in my entire life. It's moments like that, that make racial ambiguity so worthwhile. :lol:

. Like, one time, a lady called because she thought her cat was in heat, and she said to me, "she keeps sticking her **** up in the air".

ROFLMAO.

I think that's hilarious, I can't stop laughing. LOL! And I can't believe that word wasn't blocked out, ahahahah. Okay, so I'm classless. :p

And I think that while you may mean well, your post still comes off as racist. It's obvious when you're saying 'gangbangers' you mean "mainly black people, with the occasional white thrown in." It's just reeks in your post, whether you realize it or not.

You don't like gangbangers. Maybe these 'gangbangers' don't like emos with long hair. What's the difference? It's not any more right for you to claim they are gangbangers than it is for them to say your boyfriend is a '******'. Two wrongs don't make a right.

And how are they gangbangers just by standing around? That's not gangbanging, that's just standing around making rude comments at anybody that walks by. Immature and rude, yes, but gangbanging? No. Listening to rap music and standing around like you're Thug Jrs doesn't make you a gangbanger. Come on now. :rolleyes:

If you would attempt to converse with them rather than walk by them like you're scared that at any second you'll be mugged or raped, you might see things differently. Your attitude is showing them that you dislike them, and it's probably the result of their comments.

Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT trying to be nasty to you. But I do kind of think you're coming off as racist whether you see it or not.

Sooo.... theres some rap that glorifies sexism, drugs and disrespect. Look in your little CD collection and describe just the *covers* of the CD's of half your little rock bands and tell me again about music being the influence of drug use, misogyny, and disrespectful behavior. It's more of an environmental influence hun, not some idiot in excessive jewelry talking about his life on the streets. Even the most "ghetto" know the music is for entertainment and are also fully aware of the fact that most of those guys are exaggerating about their experiences quite a bit. When do you even hear gangster rap anymore anyway? 99% of the rap songs i've heard in the last 8 years have been about drinking, going to the club, and watching some strippers. Last I checked, that's all most rocks bands and even quite a bit of country musicians sing about as well. That's just MEN running their mouths. It's not one style of music, but it's the only one you dislike, so it's the only one you mention.




Right on, Nishkitten. I wanted to say something about the poster's probable rock collection but then again, I didn't want to judge her for her picture (she has a bit of a rockerchick/emo chick thing going on) just like she judges these 'ghetto' people for the color of their skin and where they live.

My BF, who is the world's hugest fan of gangster rap, goes on and on and on about how the rap music today just sucks, how it's all about the club scene and there's always some new stupid dance. He likes all the stuff from the 90's, 2pac in particular. And he's white and loves to work on computers and isn't 'packin' heat', and doesn't want to :censored: this b*tch and that b*tch or meet a woman like Blowjob Betty (Too Short). He just likes it because he does. It's his thing. It doesn't make him a 'gangbanger'. Then again, I think in Dara's theory he couldn't possibly be one, since he's white. ;)

I on the other hand like rock music, and not all of it talks about sunshine and love and respect for others. You'll find that most music doesn't. So it's NOT just rap that glorifies things that aren't always so savory.

So I find it really funny that Dara-whatever her name also judges people by the friggin' MUSIC that they listen to as well as for living in the 'ghetto'. My god, do you think people in the ghetto want to be there? Don't you think there are whites living in trailer parks who are the equivalent? I wasn't aware that it's only blacks who are poor. :rolleyes:

(Dara, I'm not attacking you or your picture. I like your style, just for the record. But I assume by it that you probably listen to rock or emo music, and maybe you don't at all. Isn't it wrong for me to assume that you like rock or emo just because of the way you look? Just like it's wrong for you to assume someone's a gangbanger just because they're black, or use the C word, or use profane language, or make some stupid comment about how you're walking. For the record, I use the C word quite frequently, I use profanity IRL in nearly every sentence I say (that's nothing to brag about, but I'm just making a point), and I'm not a gangbanger. I'm white and I listen to some crazy rock like Black Sabbath and Marilyn Manson yet I'm blonde, love makeup, and I like to wear pink and blue. You'd imagine I'd be rockin' the black hair look with red streaks and black fingernails and black lipstick, but I don't. (Okay, I dabbled in high school.) You cannot judge people for how they look anymore than what they listen to.

been there - totally.
i have dating just about every race and its been a while since i have been with a white guy.
im with a mexican guy right now, before that - black, before that - cuban, before that - israeli, etc... etc...
my family has never been on board with any of it - at all.
my grandmother has stopped speaking to be completely, stating "i would rather you be a lesbian than be with anyone of a different color" - as if either one were bad!!! grrrrr.... but i blame that mostly on the generation and ignorance.
the one thing i have noticed that as soon as there is a problem in the relationship, my family blames their race first.
but, the fact is - i live 3000 miles away from any of my family and they can either accept it or not see me. :)
it worked so far, if V is not allow to come into your house because you dont accept his race, i will not be coming to your house period. although it goes a lot of different ways.
ah well, society is getting better about this, but there is def still along way to go~!

And I think that while you may mean well, your post still comes off as racist. It's obvious when you're saying 'gangbangers' you mean "mainly black people, with the occasional white thrown in." It's just reeks in your post, whether you realize it or not.

You don't like gangbangers. Maybe these 'gangbangers' don't like emos with long hair. What's the difference? It's not any more right for you to claim they are gangbangers than it is for them to say your boyfriend is a '******'. Two wrongs don't make a right.

And how are they gangbangers just by standing around? That's not gangbanging, that's just standing around making rude comments at anybody that walks by. Immature and rude, yes, but gangbanging? No. Listening to rap music and standing around like you're Thug Jrs doesn't make you a gangbanger. Come on now. :rolleyes:

If you would attempt to converse with them rather than walk by them like you're scared that at any second you'll be mugged or raped, you might see things differently. Your attitude is showing them that you dislike them, and it's probably the result of their comments.

Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT trying to be nasty to you. But I do kind of think you're coming off as racist whether you see it or not.

Ah, hmm. Well, I guess I would have an opinion somewhere in between yours and hers. But I'm sorry, she *should* be scared of being raped or mugged by people who talk like that, gangbanger or not. Maybe it's all talk, but it would be just plain stupid to ignore the loud and clear warning their talk gives. "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!" ????? She is not paranoid. I think it is *extremely* foolish advice to try to converse with them.

Ah, hmm. Well, I guess I would have an opinion somewhere in between yours and hers. But I'm sorry, she *should* be scared of being raped or mugged by people who talk like that, gangbanger or not. Maybe it's all talk, but it would be just plain stupid to ignore the loud and clear warning their talk gives. "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!" ????? She is not paranoid. I think it is *extremely* foolish advice to try to converse with them.

Are you serious!? How is your advice to be afraid of everybody helping her out? Okay, here's something to blow your mind -- in my time in the army EVERY GUY I ever met in the military said way worse stuff than that on a daily basis! To each other, and to anyone else. Just because they're rude and happen to be black doesn't make them violent criminals and rapists. I thought my neighbor with the big harley, shaved head that listened to Pantera and wore Doc's was a skinhead, but I didn't run away in fear from him. Good thing I didn't either, because it turns out he's an extremely nice man and a gifted mechanic and handyman who does maintenance on both of our cars provided I make him up a plate when I cook dinner and take it over to him once in awhile. He also recently re-floored my kitchen for me for no money. He just loves Moroccan and Creole food.

Just because people are different doesn't automatically make them dangerous, and obvious FEAR is what will make you an easy target in case they are. Your point is moot.

Matter of fact, most rapists and potential rapists seem to typically be very charming, well-dressed, have families, and are ... *gasp!* white. Ted Bundy, BTK anyone?

My dad was a little scared that my boyfriend is british. He was like "Ya know, the culture is SO MUCH different....they drink a lot and they aren't known for their teeth..." I was like OH DEAR GOD.

My dad was actually nervous that I am dating someone from a different country! He even told Chris one night, "I think you're English is getting better!" I was like, "Dad, he is FROM England....." I know he just meant that understanding Chris is getting easier because Chris is a very thick english accent but COME ON!

I don't think it should matter what, race, religion or background loves come from - but quite frankly I think love is blind to all that.

Are you serious!? How is your advice to be afraid of everybody helping her out? Okay, here's something to blow your mind -- in my time in the army EVERY GUY I ever met in the military said way worse stuff than that on a daily basis! To each other, and to anyone else. Just because they're rude and happen to be black doesn't make them violent criminals and rapists. I thought my neighbor with the big harley, shaved head that listened to Pantera and wore Doc's was a skinhead, but I didn't run away in fear from him. Good thing I didn't either, because it turns out he's an extremely nice man and a gifted mechanic and handyman who does maintenance on both of our cars provided I make him up a plate when I cook dinner and take it over to him once in awhile. He also recently re-floored my kitchen for me for no money. He just loves Moroccan and Creole food.

Just because people are different doesn't automatically make them dangerous, and obvious FEAR is what will make you an easy target in case they are. Your point is moot.

Matter of fact, most rapists and potential rapists seem to typically be very charming, well-dressed, have families, and are ... *gasp!* white. Ted Bundy, BTK anyone?

Uh, where in the world did I say everybody??????? I said, be afraid of people who say things like "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!" I stand by what I said.

I also said *nothing* about color. I referred only to what was spoken to her.

I never said be afraid of anyone who is different. If they're different enough that they say things like "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!", then he** yes, I will be afraid. I could care less what color that person is. If they are white, I would not feel one bit less afraid.

Yes, I am totally serious.

Ah, hmm. Well, I guess I would have an opinion somewhere in between yours and hers. But I'm sorry, she *should* be scared of being raped or mugged by people who talk like that, gangbanger or not. Maybe it's all talk, but it would be just plain stupid to ignore the loud and clear warning their talk gives. "she walkin' like she got ****ed real hard!" ????? She is not paranoid. I think it is *extremely* foolish advice to try to converse with them.

Oh for the love of god. Let's be real here. Men can be pigs, everyone knows that. I don't know ANY guy who hasn't said some 'oh so charming' comment like that to a female. I'm sure my boyfriend came out with some gems when he was single. :rolleyes: As a matter of fact, I AM sure, because when I first met him, he made a comment about how I was sexy and which ways he'd like to **** me. I was offended and disgusted, but I realized it for what it was. It's just dudes being asinine, that doesn't mean he was gonna drag me off and rape me. C'mon. And I know not every guy will make a comment like that, but a lot of them will when they're trying to look bad-@ss in front of other guys or for whatever idiotic reason goes on in their head. Despite his little comment, my s.o. turned out to be better than that.

Should I have been terrified that he was going to assault me? :rolleyes:

I think it's foolish advice for her to behave snobbishly towards them just because they're black and they make asinine comments. The next time they say something like that, she should make a flippant comment back and smile. Note, I said FLIPPANT, not flirty. Maybe they'll refrain from making stupid comments when they see she's not another white person in the world judging them for being black.

luvja-

Not to play devil's advocate, but you stated that you date black men primarily...and that you tried to date a white guy ONCE, but it didn't work out (nothing in common with them, don't like the same music, style, etc.).

Basically, that is stereotyping. ;)

Now, there is nothing wrong with an interracial relationship (I am in one!) but you are basically stereotyping ALL white men, based on dating ONE of them. I dated many white men before I got married-some liked hard rock, some liked emo, some liked rap, and some liked country. Some of them dressed alternative, some dressed preppy, some wore business suits, and some dressed in more club styled attire.

They are all different. You can't say that you don't have anything in common with ALL of them-based on dating one of them.

If are you are just more physically attracted to black men, then that is fine...but it's not fair to stereotype all white men, saying you have nothing in common with them-simply because you didn't with ONE of them.


**FYI-I am married to a Native American man, Oglala Sioux. We have three children who are mixed-white and Native American. I have also dated people of other religions, many colors, and even different genders in my life.

Umm, just because they said "oh, she's walking like she got :censored:!" doesn't mean that they were saying they wanted to have sex with her or even that they found her attractive. They were just making a rude comment about how apparently stupid she was walking. I admit I've seen people walking strangely before, for whatever reasons, and my friends and I would laugh and giggle and whisper about them looking like a certain censored scenario, but that didn't mean I wanted to rape the damn people.

Well, whether or not the remark is sexual or not, or it is just giggling, etc...I find it pretty immature and rude to sit around and comment about someone's walk out loud where they can hear you.

I would also like to remind everyone to keep their language more respectful, please. We have a :censored: smilie. ;)

Oh for the love of god. Let's be real here. Men can be pigs, everyone knows that. I don't know ANY guy who hasn't said some 'oh so charming' comment like that to a female. I'm sure my boyfriend came out with some gems when he was single. :rolleyes: As a matter of fact, I AM sure, because when I first met him, he made a comment about how I was sexy and which ways he'd like to **** me. I was offended and disgusted, but I realized it for what it was. It's just dudes being asinine, that doesn't mean he was gonna drag me off and rape me. C'mon. And I know not every guy will make a comment like that, but a lot of them will when they're trying to look bad-@ss in front of other guys or for whatever idiotic reason goes on in their head. Despite his little comment, my s.o. turned out to be better than that.

Should I have been terrified that he was going to assault me? :rolleyes:

I think it's foolish advice for her to behave snobbishly towards them just because they're black and they make asinine comments. The next time they say something like that, she should make a flippant comment back and smile. Note, I said FLIPPANT, not flirty. Maybe they'll refrain from making stupid comments when they see she's not another white person in the world judging them for being black.

Umm, just because they said "oh, she's walking like she got ****ed real hard!" doesn't mean that they were saying they wanted to have sex with her or even that they found her attractive. They were just making a rude comment about how apparently stupid she was walking. I admit I've seen people walking strangely before, for whatever reasons, and my friends and I would laugh and giggle and whisper about similar things, and that doesn't mean I wanted to rape the damn people.

Your friends are different than mine then. And if you assume that means I grew up rich and sheltered, you'd be making a big fat wrong assumption. No one has to put up with company that speaks like that. It is not OK. Clearly, YMMV.

I'm not going to lie, My main reason why I don't date white men, is because I don't find them attractive. Bottom line.


luvja-

Not to play devil's advocate, but you stated that you date black men primarily...and that you tried to date a white guy ONCE, but it didn't work out (nothing in common with them, don't like the same music, style, etc.).

Basically, that is stereotyping. ;)

Now, there is nothing wrong with an interracial relationship (I am in one!) but you are basically stereotyping ALL white men, based on dating ONE of them. I dated many white men before I got married-some liked hard rock, some liked emo, some liked rap, and some liked country. Some of them dressed alternative, some dressed preppy, some wore business suits, and some dressed in more club styled attire.

They are all different. You can't say that you don't have anything in common with ALL of them-based on dating one of them.

If are you are just more physically attracted to black men, then that is fine...but it's not fair to stereotype all white men, saying you have nothing in common with them-simply because you didn't with ONE of them.


**FYI-I am married to a Native American man, Oglala Sioux. We have three children who are mixed-white and Native American. I have also dated people of other religions, many colors, and even different genders in my life.

Aphil, I definitely agree that it IS rude and immature for them to comment on her walk, I never said otherwise. I'm just arguing the point that it's not necessarily a statement that means underneath, "I wanna rape her!!" Also, thanks for telling me about the censor smiley, I've got to find that because I know I'm pushing it with all of my starred out words. :)

Testing, testing: :censored:

Julie, my friends are not different that yours. Let's not start judging people's friends based upon my statement that I feel that some idiots making an idiotic comment about a girl's walk does not make them rapists. And if you've never heard guys talk about girls like that before when they walk by, I guess they chose not to do it in front of you.

I don't think anyone should have to put up with company like that either. If someone made a comment like that towards me, white, black, or blue they would be. If you catch my drift. (I'd slap somebody!)

I'm making the point that some people, white, black, yellow, purple, red, green, teal, make stupid comments about others. I'm sure you're not immune. I'm sure you've thought some things in your head about others before, but didn't speak it. The difference between some of us and the guys in the scenario is that they spoke their mind, and it was rude.

But that their offensive statements showed intent to rape? Now that's just laughable.

What does that abbreviation mean? I just recently learned what PITA meant, SAHM, and SSDD.

Maybe they'll refrain from making stupid comments when they see she's not another white person in the world judging them for being black.

My my, Melanie, I do not agree with your mindset. With this sentence you are saying that she has to prove to them that she is not a racist??? Or are you saying THEY are racists???

Personally I think that everybody should be treated the same way. Nobody should prove anything to anybody.

To me it feels as if Julie posted her opinion, and you are attacking her on it.

I think that you should reply to the original post, and keep your uncalled comments for yourself.

I feel like singing Micheal Jacksons "Black or White" from some reason now....

My my, Melanie, I do not agree with your mindset. With this sentence you are saying that she has to prove to them that she is not a racist??? Or are you saying THEY are racists???

That's fine if you don't agree. Diversity is what makes the human race beautiful, as does diversity in opinion. ;)

I didn't say anyone had to prove anything, I just said perhaps they think she is racist and that's why they make rude comments about her. That is not a justification for their rude comments, it's plain and simply rude. But her attitude is as well.

Personally I think that everybody should be treated the same way. Nobody should prove anything to anybody.

To me it feels as if Julie posted her opinion, and you are attacking her on it.

I think that you should reply to the original post, and keep your uncalled comments for yourself.

I'm not attacking Julie on her opinion, I considered it a discussion. If Julie feels attacked, I apologize. I know Julie has a differing opinion and that's fine. But I have an opinion too, and should be allowed to share it. You're contradicting yourself by saying that Julie should be able to post her opinion, but I on the otherhand should keep my opinions to myself. How does that make sense?

I'm not going to hold in my opinion just because you don't agree with it.

That's fine if you don't agree. Diversity is what makes the human race beautiful, as does diversity in opinion. ;)

I didn't say anyone had to prove anything, I just said perhaps they think she is racist and that's why they make rude comments about her. That is not a justification for their rude comments, it's plain and simply rude. But her attitude is as well.



I'm not attacking Julie on her opinion, I considered it a discussion. If Julie feels attacked, I apologize. I know Julie has a differing opinion and that's fine. But I have an opinion too, and should be allowed to share it. You're contradicting yourself by saying that Julie should be able to post her opinion, but I on the otherhand should keep my opinions to myself. How does that make sense?

I'm not going to hold in my opinion just because you don't agree with it.

Okay, thanks for the reply - it was much nicer than I expected - Thank you for that. - Then we agree to disagree. :)

First off, I want to say that I listen to folk music primarily, and some Indie stuff. I'm also into some 90's grunge. So, rock and emo is about as appealing to me as rap and country.

For those who hate the "rap" lifestyle. They have no one but white people to thank. White people put out the blacksplotation movies of the 70's (Tupac's mom has done a lot of interviews about how much he loved those movies). And that's where most of the "rap culture" stems from.

They sent the clear message that for black people to survive the movie they had to be a drug dealer, a pimp or both. And then people wonder how this stuff starts. :dizzy:

It's just an easier way to be racist. Thinking that "they" just "choose" to be that way. No, it was sold to them by those in power.

Women are sold the exact same BS about how we should be skinny, blonde and submissive, but somehow that's all blamed on the media.

No. They cannot blame the way rap music is on movies from the 70's. The wonderful thing about being a human being is we are intelligent beings that can make up our own minds and live our own lives. At least I can, I guess I can't really speak for everyone.



ROFLMAO.

I think that's hilarious, I can't stop laughing. LOL! And I can't believe that word wasn't blocked out, ahahahah. Okay, so I'm classless. :p

And I think that while you may mean well, your post still comes off as racist. It's obvious when you're saying 'gangbangers' you mean "mainly black people, with the occasional white thrown in." It's just reeks in your post, whether you realize it or not.

You don't like gangbangers. Maybe these 'gangbangers' don't like emos with long hair. What's the difference? It's not any more right for you to claim they are gangbangers than it is for them to say your boyfriend is a '******'. Two wrongs don't make a right.

And how are they gangbangers just by standing around? That's not gangbanging, that's just standing around making rude comments at anybody that walks by. Immature and rude, yes, but gangbanging? No. Listening to rap music and standing around like you're Thug Jrs doesn't make you a gangbanger. Come on now. :rolleyes:

If you would attempt to converse with them rather than walk by them like you're scared that at any second you'll be mugged or raped, you might see things differently. Your attitude is showing them that you dislike them, and it's probably the result of their comments.

Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT trying to be nasty to you. But I do kind of think you're coming off as racist whether you see it or not.


I used the word "gangbanger" because I asked my boyfriend what I should say to make it the least offensive as possible. He wasn't sure, but that is what we came up with. My intentions were to not be offensive.

BUT-if my opinions make me racists, then I'm racists. There, I said it, I'm racists. That is, if the definition of race is "people that act in a very disrepectful way towards people who mind their own business" and not "the color of a person's skin".

And I hate emos with long hair as well.

And when I was referring to the woman that called my work about her cat's hoo-hoo being in the air, I was just putting more evidence towards how inappropriate they can be.



I was going to quote each post as I refer to it, but it takes too much time. So-a few thoughts-

1.)I have plenty of friends that would make the "****ed real hard" comment, but not to a complete stranger. And I didn't say that I thought they were going to rape me, or they were trying to hit on me. They were just being rude. And the fact that they think it's ok to say that makes me afraid of them. It just proves their character. So maybe they wouldn't rape me, but they might be the kind of people that would steal my purse.

2.)When did I say I was acting snobby towards them? I just walk by minding my own business. And so does my boyfriend. Actually, sometimes he says rude things back to them, but they always start it. I pass them just as I would anyone on the street. If we make eye contact I smile, otherwise I just walk by.

Aphil- thank you! She did say she exclusively dates black men. And I'm the racist. Ha! I would date a black man in a second if we were into the same things.

oh-and all the stuff about them making the comments because I'm racists- I guess I was just unaware that the people I walk by are psychic. They somehow peer into my thoughts and know that I don't like them in the five seconds it takes me to pass them. And don't tell me the can tell by my body language or something. Like I said earlier, I'm just walking like I normally walk.

Sorry about the language too. I really thought the c-word would be censored. :dizzy:

I think that's it. I'm sure I forgot something. Oh well.

Interracial dating is a big deal because many consider it a taboo subject.

I'm half Native American, Choctaw to be exact so you'd have to ask my white, polish husband what his parents thought of us dating. Then again they didn't know until I told them ;) Couple that with doing "those" parties and I'm a regular black sheep! lol

I figure it this way....it's their loss. Don't let their opinions or anyone else's keep you from being happy.

First off, I want to say that I listen to folk music primarily, and some Indie stuff. I'm also into some 90's grunge. So, rock and emo is about as appealing to me as rap and country.


I like indie and 90's grunge, but I consider it under the widely varied category of rock. Just thought I'd add my two cents in. Anyway, my point was to show you how people can easily assume things by the way you look. :)

I used the word "gangbanger" because I asked my boyfriend what I should say to make it the least offensive as possible. He wasn't sure, but that is what we came up with. My intentions were to not be offensive.

BUT-if my opinions make me racists, then I'm racists. There, I said it, I'm racists. That is, if the definition of race is "people that act in a very disrepectful way towards people who mind their own business" and not "the color of a person's skin".

And I hate emos with long hair as well.

And when I was referring to the woman that called my work about her cat's hoo-hoo being in the air, I was just putting more evidence towards how inappropriate they can be.

Just WHO are they? My god. When you were talking about what the woman said, you were quoting it in stereotypical 'ebonic' speak. It was obvious you were indicating a black woman because you were using the stereotyped ebonics and using the stereotypes of black gangbangers to prove some point. Anyway, this woman called on the phone. Just because she used the C word doesn't make her a gangbanger. Inappropriate, yes. Certainly. Gangbanger? No. How did you know? Could you see through the phoneline? You were basing your judgment solely because she was black. Why is that?

(Btw, it gives me a chuckle when you say "racists." :p )




1.)I have plenty of friends that would make the "****ed real hard" comment, but not to a complete stranger. And I didn't say that I thought they were going to rape me, or they were trying to hit on me. They were just being rude. And the fact that they think it's ok to say that makes me afraid of them. It just proves their character. So maybe they wouldn't rape me, but they might be the kind of people that would steal my purse.

They didn't say, "hey, let's steal that white girl's purse. She would make an easy target because we don't care if she hears what we say." They said you looked like you had been :censored: real hard. To me, yes that was rude and inappropriate and it shouldn't have been said. But it's just a jack@ss kind of comment that people make all of the time. It was in no way related to stealing your purse. Also, someone else pointed out that criminals don't have to be rude and coarse and profane. Criminals can be quite refined, charming, intelligent, and etc. Just because they made idiot comments does not mean they were all hot to steal your purse.

.)When did I say I was acting snobby towards them? I just walk by minding my own business. And so does my boyfriend. Actually, sometimes he says rude things back to them, but they always start it. I pass them just as I would anyone on the street. If we make eye contact I smile, otherwise I just walk by.

I understand that, and I understand it was rude what they said, and what they say. They're just a small sampling of people in the world, from the group known as "Rude People." "Rude People" consists of blacks, asians, whites, native american, hispanic, etc, etc, etc. It has nothing to do with them being gangbangers and black.

oh-and all the stuff about them making the comments because I'm racists- I guess I was just unaware that the people I walk by are psychic. They somehow peer into my thoughts and know that I don't like them in the five seconds it takes me to pass them. And don't tell me the can tell by my body language or something. Like I said earlier, I'm just walking like I normally walk.

My bad, I just assumed that they could tell you didn't like them, just by the things you were saying which showed all of us that you didn't like them. Didn't mean to assume. I just thought if you said hey, what's up, or something to them, they might be less inclined to run their mouths as you walk by, if they know you as a person, and not just a object. (Personalization.)

Sorry about the language too. I really thought the c-word would be censored. :dizzy:
.

I was laughing so hard I nearly peed.

Anyway, that's just my two cents, and it's kinda like beating the dead horse now. Everyone thinks differently and I could run my mouth all night but I still couldn't convince you not to judge them for listening to rap music and saying stupid things. Better to let things lie.

:)

The dancing carrot makes me happy. :carrot:

Well, whether or not the remark is sexual or not, or it is just giggling, etc...I find it pretty immature and rude to sit around and comment about someone's walk out loud where they can hear you.

I would also like to remind everyone to keep their language more respectful, please. We have a :censored: smilie. ;)

Agreed, Aphil. I don't find anything excusable about making a comment like that. I would never attempt to converse with someone who said that to me (or about me within earshot) because I think it's trashy. I'm sorry, but if someone said that in my presence about me, my reaction would not be, "hey you look like a swell guy let's be BFF!".

Also, re: stereotyping based on music choices are just plain silly. A someone who has worked extensively within the music industry I can assure you that music branding and genre has nothing to do with socioeconomic placement, lifestyle, or even demographic. I am a white girl from the mountains and looooooove my newgrass and Dave Matthews...

And I heart 90's gangsta rap. Sounds of my childhood in small, upper class, white bread Colorado.

RIP Biggie.

And on the topic at hand. I think if you date someone because they are or AREN'T white, black, hispanic, Antarctican you missed the point. I think it's AWESOME that in the span of a generation we are breaking down the social boundries of acceptability. Our parents were likely brought up during Jim Crow. Their great grandparents may have owned slaves. And here we are thinking that our folk's are foolish for thinking it a faux pas to date someone outside of your race. While racism is alive and well in this country, we have certainly come a long way in our thoughts on what is socially acceptable and it should be socially acceptable to believe that love is colorblind- that you love who you love, not because you like black men or white men or purple men or orange women, but because you just love who you love.

wow, this is a pretty heavy thread!

i just wanted to throw in my experience. Back in the early 70s, my white, Jewish mom married a very black man, southern (she's born and raised Jersey), totally different culture. She had never done anything before or after that broke the rules, this was pretty much it. Her parents didn't attend the wedding. She had two sons (my older brothers) before her husband died. About 8 or 9 years later, she met and married my father, a white Jewish guy, the guy her parents probably would have wanted her to be with in the first place. They're still married and seem pretty happy.
Now, I've never seriously dated a black man, but the subject has come up, and my mother is surprisingly unsupportive of the idea, but I take her advice more seriously because she's been through it. The difficulties she faced were real, especially in the early 70s in Newark, NJ. But, she also recognizes that now isn't then, and no matter what, I know she'll support my happiness. My brother (half black) is now married to a white Irish woman, and while my mom isn't thrilled about her Catholicism, she is thrilled for their strong relationship and her new grandchild. Race doesn't really enter into that equation. Religion does.

anyway, i think the point is to live your life for you. Easier said than done, but the fact is that some people will always disapprove, just like they're going to disapprove of the clothes you wear or the food you eat. But, what can you do? You're the only person who you CONSTANTLY have to hang out with, so you're really the most important person to have happy with you. Cliche, i know. But true.

S

Yes -- the worst thing in the world you can do, in any situation, is patronize someone, imo.

My my, Melanie, I do not agree with your mindset. With this sentence you are saying that she has to prove to them that she is not a racist??? Or are you saying THEY are racists???

Personally I think that everybody should be treated the same way. Nobody should prove anything to anybody.

I agree that saying I only date black men or I only date white or asian or anything other than I only date men (vs I only date women vs I'll date anything with two legs) is just as bad.

As a parent who strongly remembers being a teen I can tell you that there is a bit of defiance in a child who is ONLY attracted to the type of person that upsets their parents.

my sons are grown. and were raised by their dad and stepmom and are NOT allowed to even date girls that are not Jewish. I was not allowed to either. interestingly my husband is not jewish now. my father took nearly 4 years of marriage to accept that he's a good man.

The dancing carrot makes me happy. :carrot:

Hahahaha!! That is so funny!!

This thread is a bit heavy. I think it needs more carrots.

:carrot::carrot::carrot::carrot::carrot::carrot: :carrot: :carrot:

I agree that, not to sound TOO cheesy, that it really is the inside that counts in these kinds of issues -- writing off whole racial segments of the population as undesireable is kind of a trap.

But then again, people are attracted to what they're attracted to and you can only argue against that to a point. Of course, falling in love with someone who doesn't fit your type can happen (and often does!) but lots of people have a type that they're primarily attracted to, myself included. My type isn't all that strange, really, or controversial, but I *LOVE* really Mediterranean looking men -- olive complexion, dark hair, strong Roman nose (I have a *thing* for strong, angular noses, heh) -- as Southern European-looking as possible. That's not to say that I've never dated/been attracted to a guy that doesn't fit that description, but if I'm being completely honest, those are the guys I tend to find best looking. And of course, men that look that way aren't always the best boyfriend-material either but they're nice to look at on the subway ;)

I agree that saying I only date black men or I only date white or asian or anything other than I only date men (vs I only date women vs I'll date anything with two legs) is just as bad.

Yup, everyone has a preference to what they "look" at first, you get me?.
I automatically look at black men first, I love me some sexy dark chocolate. (haha oh God).
That's just my nature.... however, I have seen men of other races that I thought were hot. I do like spanish men to, however we don't have many spanish people around here, so I've never actually spoke to one. But I do think their attractive.
White men can be hot too... Black men just catch my eye first.
There's a lot of tension in here, which I didn't intend for.
If you don't have anything nice to say, keep it to yourself. :D

THAT is pretty interesting. Growing up, my very conservative parents put some pretty um... strong limitations on who I could date. It was never really an issue, as I was so so overweight and had such low self-esteem for most of my life that I never dated anyone til my 20's and I met my fiance shortly thereafter. When I DId meet my fiance, who is European (Balkan), I expected they'd take issue with his foreign-ness and, even more so, with the fact that he's Muslim. But oddly, they never did. We're not religious, but we are Catholic, and he's not a religious Muslim at all, but I was expecting much more trouble from them about his religion, considering how conservative they are ab everything else. It never happened. I guess people can surprise you!

My brother (half black) is now married to a white Irish woman, and while my mom isn't thrilled about her Catholicism, she is thrilled for their strong relationship and her new grandchild. Race doesn't really enter into that equation. Religion does.

Rather than go around quoting different things in this entire thread (because I would have 10,000 quotes and my post would be WAY too long) I just want to give you all some of my opinions.

***My first opinion is on the "agree to disagree" thing. We all have different opinions, and that is fine. However, if your opinion differs from another, those differences can be expressed in a NICE way. Flaming others, and picking fights is against the 3FC rules.

It isn't the fact that people disagree that gets threads closed-it is the manner in which people start typing/speaking to one another. If you disagree with someone, it should be in a respectful, adult manner. Please keep this in mind.

***Secondly, the language. I did make a note that we have a :censored: smilie. Also, I would like to add that the way someone speaks affects how people view them. I am a dance instructor, performer, and troupe director-and I could have the BEST dancer in the world, but I would not have someone work with me if they did not speak and act in a professional manner. I currently have a young lady in one of my classes who would be a phenominal performer, but I will not put her in my troupe, and her language and the way that she acts is the reason. I cannot have her at festivals, charity events, and so on-with me, if she is going to be smoking cigarettes in her costume right before we go on stage, talking about her taking her ex to court, and peppering her stories with obscenities.

I do not think that the poster who was speaking about the people calling the vet's office was being racist. I deal with the same thing in my community-and it is people of all walks of life, and all colors. Some people simply do not have decorum, and act properly in public. I have had people sit at the next table at expensive restaurants, where I am with my husband and three young CHILDREN, and they talk trash and use obscene language where everyone can hear.

In my opinion, if you are at home, or a party with friends-talk however you want. When you are calling a business, at a job interview, or in a place where there are other people present-you should act like it. It goes for the forum as well. There are people of all walks of life here-everyone from teenagers to great grandmothers, and of all religions and backgrounds. What may be normal speak to you, might be highly offensive to someone else.

When people swear constantly, and talk about inappropriate things, it honestly makes me think less of them. It also makes me think of them as less educated, because they seem to have no other way of expressing themselves, other than with obscenities. How you speak affects other's perception of you. How you act and speak affects how people see you. It has nothing to do with race. If someone comes up to me who is well spoken, I think much higher of them than I would if they were using "F" in every other sentence.

So, it isn't always your opinion or view that turns someone off...often it is in the manner that it is spoken (or typed).


***I FULLY disagree with people who blame the past solely for their problems of today. I do. I think that it is passing the buck, and not taking responsibity for your own actions.

I think that it is ridiculous rap music, and the gangster lifestyle to be blamed on white people back in the 70's. If you are going to be a rapper, or be a gangster, or whatever-you are going to do it because you choose to do it. Don't blame it on history.

My husband is Native American. His father was born on the reservation, in a teepee, with no birth certificate. They are both registered Oglala Sioux. They didn't even record his father's birthdate-so the government GAVE him one. I wanted to clarify this, so you would not think that he is one of those people who say "I am 1/16th Native American" and don't even know what nation, etc. that it even came from. My husband's father was shot in a police brutality incident when my husband was in high school. His father was shot in cold blood, and was unarmed. It's a long story, but there was no fighting, or anything involved. His father was simply walking home.

The reason that I am mentioning this, is because if ANYONE has a right to sit back and blame all of their problems on their race, and on white people-it is my husband. I am tired of people blaming everything on racism, when a good deal of the time, their own actions and attitudes are to blame. My husband could have sat back, got checks from the government, and drank himself to death-and blamed it on white people. He didn't. Instead, he went to college, got 2 degrees, and has a successful career, kids, and a wife.

I am tired of people saying that I (and other white people) have it easy, because we are "white". My husband isn't blaming every white person in the world for what happened to his father. He blames one man-the policeman who shot him. "I" don't want to be blamed for things because I am white. I never owned slaves, and neither did my parents, or grandparents, or great grandparents. Why should I be blamed for something that I had nothing do do with. On that same note, why should an 18 year old minority be using that excuse, when he was never a slave, nor his parents, nor his grandparents? We have a young generation that is blaming one another for actions that happened in history that none of us were involved with. How many years are we going to continue to use that tragic happening as an excuse?

If people want equality, and want racism to stop-then those same people need to stop pulling the race card out when something happens that they don't like. As long as people continue to blame other races for their lot in life, or "use" being a minority to get what they want...then racism is going to continue. You can't have it both ways.

aphil -- I agree with you 100%, ab everything.

Imo, past racism, government policies towards certain racial or ethnic groups, social attitudes towards certain races or groups, whatever, *DO* play a part in the current race situation in the US (even though many would say that situation is improving, at least somewhat), but eventually the culture of victimhood HAS TO END for progress to be made. Period.

Has injustice existed in the US? Absolutely. Does it STILL exist? No question. But injustice will always exist, towards certain races, religions, GENDERs, what have you, bc society will never be perfect. But for people to do well, to prosper and to improve the social situation, people need to accept responsibility for their own lives and happiness and not pass blame onto others. You can't change or undo the past and harping on the past doesn't fix the present. Does that mean we forget ab the past, or ignore it? NO NO NO! but it does mean we move forward -- you draw strength from the past, not excuses, not reasons to feel like a victim.

At least imo.

I'm not going to jump back in because while I love a discussion with someone who sees things differently than me, it's not fun to keep defending yourself against things you never said in the first place; and frankly the hostility ate at me all day while I was trying to enjoy my company who were visiting from out of state.

And I did not mean mean to hijack the original question.

But I didn't want to just drop out on people who were responding to me. I only got back late last night.

The dancing carrot makes me happy. :carrot:

Thanks Taylor, that made me feel better :D

Aphil-not to sound creepy, but I love you. I agree with everything you said.:D

So anywho-we are all agreeing to disagree. I think that's wonderful. And I'm sorry to anyone that I offended, but that is just the way that I feel, and it would take a lot to make me change my mind, and that is for sure not happening in this forum. I guess I just get so used to debating my opinion in the vegan forums I visit that I forget that this forum is a little less, um, intended for arguments and more for supporting each other. ;)

Here, lets have some of these: :carrot::carrot::carrot:

I agree that, not to sound TOO cheesy, that it really is the inside that counts in these kinds of issues -- writing off whole racial segments of the population as undesireable is kind of a trap.

But then again, people are attracted to what they're attracted to and you can only argue against that to a point. Of course, falling in love with someone who doesn't fit your type can happen (and often does!) but lots of people have a type that they're primarily attracted to, myself included. My type isn't all that strange, really, or controversial, but I *LOVE* really Mediterranean looking men -- olive complexion, dark hair, strong Roman nose (I have a *thing* for strong, angular noses, heh) -- as Southern European-looking as possible. That's not to say that I've never dated/been attracted to a guy that doesn't fit that description, but if I'm being completely honest, those are the guys I tend to find best looking. And of course, men that look that way aren't always the best boyfriend-material either but they're nice to look at on the subway ;)


Oh, I totally agree. I have read studies where it shows that people have a tendency to be attracted to features not unlike their own. I think people have natural attractions to certain features, whether it's like yours or totally different. You like what you like, right? It's the "I know lots of black people! My best friend is black!" or waving a big flag of pride because you exclusively date only one race. I just get the impression that it's not about you actually liking that person for who they are (and being attracted to them), but about having a certain image. I hope that wasn't too convoluted or that I offended a ton of people in one fell swoop.

I personally have never dated anyone of a different race, but for the same reasons as KLK (low self esteem, no dating in HS, etc...), but I had plenty of crushes. My mother always said I could date who I wanted but added the whole, "society may not approve..." line, which I think is bogus. Now in the late 80's, my sister *tried* to date a black guy and my mother FREAKED. So much for dating who you want, huh? But I have to have perspective about it. My sister and that guy are best friends to this day and my mother has chilled out a lot. She's always talked the open-minded talk, but she had a much harder time walking the walk. But I consider her growth an improvement from the backwoods East Texas upbringing she had where her family STILL uses the N-word (disgusting) and my aunt had to give a child up for adoption in the 70's because the father was black. I can't imagine being raised like that and because it's so unimagineable to me, I think my mom, even though she had some closet hang-ups, did something right.

I think this is a GREAT discussion and while it did get a little silly a page or two back, I think it's a thread worth keeping open. I think our fear to talk about these things only leads to more misunderstanding on the issue as a whole.

I still stand by what I said. And I'm not of the opinion that I was being unkind or flaming, there were a few comments here and there to that effect and I don't agree with that. That is because I was merely discussing my opinions and didn't have the intention to offend. I agree to agree to disagree. But just because my opinions don't equal some of yours does not mean I was flaming or being mean (someone said something about if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all or something like that. I think it's interesting how people suddenly become 'rude' or 'unkind' when they are merely stating opinions that differ from others.) Like I said, I agree to disagree and never intended on, or meant to, offend.

I was bored with discussing so I wasn't intending on making another appearance in this thread, but I did come back to read some comments, and I saw Julie's comments, and I would like to address her.

Julie (I forgot the rest of your username, so Julie it is), I didn't mean for you to feel like you were being flamed or hurt your feelings in any way. I understand that we both have very different opinions. I am a debater by nature and can argue for hours. I used to debate with my great-uncle about politics for hours and he'd get so mad, but at the end of the day I still loved my uncle despite our differing opinions and still had respect for him as well. It's just in my nature to discuss/debate and sometimes I don't realize when I cross the line between discussing and plain out arguing. And on the net, things can be misconstrued, tone and meanings can be hard to read. I feel like crap that you couldn't even enjoy your company because of my posting (I assume you meant me). I was just under the impression that we were both arguing our different view points. Never once did it cross my mind that I was actually offending you or making you feel bad. That was not my intention at all. I respect that you have a differing opinion. I was just in my "Fat Melanie Debate" mode. I'm honestly sorry. :)

Okay, thanks for the reply - it was much nicer than I expected - Thank you for that. - Then we agree to disagree. :)

Yep. :) Didn't mean to offend. :)

I still stand by what I said. And I'm not of the opinion that I was being unkind or flaming, there were a few comments here and there to that effect and I don't agree with that. That is because I was merely discussing my opinions and didn't have the intention to offend. I agree to agree to disagree. But just because my opinions don't equal some of yours does not mean I was flaming or being mean (someone said something about if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all or something like that. I think it's interesting how people suddenly become 'rude' or 'unkind' when they are merely stating opinions that differ from others.) Like I said, I agree to disagree and never intended on, or meant to, offend.

I was bored with discussing so I wasn't intending on making another appearance in this thread, but I did come back to read some comments, and I saw Julie's comments, and I would like to address her.

Julie (I forgot the rest of your username, so Julie it is), I didn't mean for you to feel like you were being flamed or hurt your feelings in any way. I understand that we both have very different opinions. I am a debater by nature and can argue for hours. I used to debate with my great-uncle about politics for hours and he'd get so mad, but at the end of the day I still loved my uncle despite our differing opinions and still had respect for him as well. It's just in my nature to discuss/debate and sometimes I don't realize when I cross the line between discussing and plain out arguing. And on the net, things can be misconstrued, tone and meanings can be hard to read. I feel like crap that you couldn't even enjoy your company because of my posting (I assume you meant me). I was just under the impression that we were both arguing our different view points. Never once did it cross my mind that I was actually offending you or making you feel bad. That was not my intention at all. I respect that you have a differing opinion. I was just in my "Fat Melanie Debate" mode. I'm honestly sorry. :)

I love to discuss too, but some posts were just grossly exaggerating what I had actually said. Probably just mixing me up with all the other posts, and I do that too sometimes, but it turns discussions into giant pointless circles. But I didn't really mean that I was offended, just that I was feeling hostile too, and I didn't like how *I* kept thinking about the thread.

I just saw the grandnephews off :D but they may be back in October.

My bf is white and im mixed-race.
I was nervous about meeting his mother at first (just in case) and when i told him this he just laughed. I found out why later cos his mother is also obsessed with black men. If anything she wants mixedrace grandchildren from me.lol
SO i was lucky on that front.
The only real hassel we've had strangley enough is from black men. They seem to hate it. OR i might get odd looks from black/mixed girls (do we care tho?um NOPE!)
What makes it worth it is when we see thos other mixed couples walking along and we all look at each other and either smile or just nod, cos its like we're fighting against something if you get what i mean?
At the end of the day yeah you love your mother but its your life!
If he makes you happy and you make him happy then whats the problem? It shouldnt effect your relationship with your mother but if it does thats down to her. Carry on with what your doing and when shes ready to get over it take it from there.
Im all for interacial relationships, i wouldnt be here without one, and that would be a terrible shame to humanity ;)
xxx

I don't wish to drag this into a different direction, but Aphil's comments about swearing reminded me of something a friend's father used to say:

When you swear, you give people an excuse to ignore everything you say.

---

So that being said and all out of the way. To the OP: I'm sorry you're dealing with someone like that. I really am.

In the end I can only end with cheese... because it's what I believe!

Date who you want. Just make sure that who you're dating is someone who respects you. That's it. Best of luck :hug: I hope your mom comes around.

So this leads me to my point. It is unfortunate that black people are linked to this lifestyle, but it is kind of a fair assumption. There are plenty of white people that live this lifestyle too, and I hate them just as much as the black people that do it, and the purple people, and the green people. My hatred and annoyance for this lifestyle is colorblind.

And the whole "rap" lifestyle that goes in hand with it is just as bad, and maybe even the cause for their behavior. The music (if you can call it that) glorifies sexism, drugs and disrespect. It's awful.

Why is this a fair assumption? Is it safe for me to assume that all white people are racists (And no, I don't assume all white people are racist, some of my best friends happen to be white)? Just because someone is black does not give anyone the right to ASSUME that they are a part of the "gangbanger" lifestyle, no matter what they look like or how they are dressed. Believe it or not, there is rap/hip hop that is fun, positive, or makes a political statement. Most of it came out in the late 80s/early 90s, but that's another assumption that you've made. And I might not like a certain kind of music, but I don't insult people who might be fans of that kind of music, because it's their own personal taste. And off the record, I don't listen to a lot of rap/hip hop that's been put out recently for the exact same reasons you've mentioned, but that's a soapbox for another thread.

You know what they say when people ASSUME...and I also think that to you "ghetto = black" - but I could be reading WAAAAAY too much into your post.

Back onto topic...

I date men of all races...black, white, hispanic, or otherwise. The racism comes from all sides, but especially from black men (I'm a black woman). When I tell a black man that I've dated white men before they get really mad. And I'm sure some in my family (especially the OLDER generation) are going to have a fit when they find out that I date white and hispanic men.

I also believe love shouldn't be color blind. The reason why I believe that is that different races are just that, different. I grew up in a military household and have even lived overseas, so I have grown to like and appreciate the differences between the races. When I date a guy of another race, I'm always interested in finding out the ways we are different as well as the ways that we are similar.

There's my two cents on this topic.

wow.

My Dh is black. I'm white. We started dating in high school- over 11 years ago in Alabama. My family is not racist but I think that my brother struggled a little. He was confused. (I believe) that he took it personally, that I was not attracted to white guys. -- That isn't even true. You know what my 'thing' is? I love big arms. DH has very big nice arms. :P even when he is not hitting the gym all the time. I told my brother that when we had a little chat one day. - I pointed out that it is not typical for white guys to have that particular build and when they do they are probably busting their butts to look like that. - More likely IMO that they will want a skinny girl, which has never been me!

I was actually lucky about the arms with DH though b/c the first night we talked was over the phone and I didn't even believe him that he was black. the first time I saw him was about a week later. Of course, he played HS football then so they were extremely defined. :drool:



It bothers me when people say they refuse to date their own race though. It actually makes me think that they must have major issues with themselves. I worked with a guy that was constantly hitting on me a few years ago. he kept saying that he wanted a white woman, that his wife had nappy hair, he wanted light skin.... etc etc.... I found his attitude completely repulsive. I am sure there was nothing wrong with his wife (aside from being married to that jerk!) and I am certainly no trophy. I'm not a "white girl", I'm a person. My DH and I do not think that way. A lot of people seem to be curious as to what race our children will date. I hope that they do not have a preference. I want them to find a good person that loves them and respects them for WHO they are. Not WHAT they are.

Awesome Thin4Good. I hope my kids find wonderful PEOPLE who bring out the best in them. I grew up in a dutch immigrant family. I am first generation Canadian. I was also the first to marry a canadian canadian. All my aunts and uncles and most of my cousins have all married people with dutch backgrounds. I am sort of the odd duck out with no dutch last name. Oh well my kids now have an easy name to spell and pronounce!

I'm late to the party here and haven't thoroughly read each and every post so please forgive me if I echo someone else but, IMHO, I don't think we have that much control over who we fall in love with or are attracted too - I mean really, and truly attracted. I know there is that old saying that "it's just as easy to fall in love with a rich man......." meaning you should pick the "proper" person to be your SO, but why should you have to "pick a type" rather than following your heart? As far as I can see, that goes for age (as long as everyone is over the age of consent), gender, or race.

I also kind of think the "staying within your race/religion/culture" is one of those leftover (for lack of a better word) *instincts* that comes from a bazillion years ago when there was strength in numbers and it was important to stay within your tribe/clan/family group so you could continue the "blood lines" and add to the numbers.

Not to say that heritage, family, and culture are no longer important, but humans are such a migratory species that, unless you need to produce and heir to a royal line, nationality doesn't have quite the same significance it once did.

Bottom line, if you truly love someone and they treat you with love and respect in return, and they make you happy - then you are with the right person.

First let me say that i am mixed. Black and white so i have experienced this A LOT in my life. For the white guys im not white enough and the black guys im not black enough. The first guy i was ever in love with was white and his mother did NOT approve of me at all. But after a while she realized that i was what made him happy and that wasnt going to change. She also had some biased opinions before meeting me that slowly changed after a while. Ive dated black guys that their moms think im snoody cause im part white. I think it has a lot to do with how they were raised and the interactions they had with a certain race. I have medium skin, dark eyes, dark curly hair and my bf is blonde and blue eyes and we get all kinds of looks when we go out. I think that if you happen to find yourself in a serious relationship with another man of a different race tell your mom how you met this guy and how wonderful he is and what he does for you and how happy you are. She may not agree at first but more than likely after a while she will learn to live with it and realize you being happy is all that matters

Oh and one more little thought. My grandparents were TOTALLY against my mom having me because i would be bi-racial and i didnt have any relationship with my grandpa for the first few years, but once she took me to see him he stopped being ignorant and loved me just as much and the other grand babies. Well the only other one at the time. My grandma was the same way but it didnt take her so long to come around