General chatter - Angry and Hurt




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KLK
07-05-2008, 06:03 PM
Ugh... please bear with me, as this might be long AND it isn't diet-related, but I need to vent what happened to me yesterday:

I got a last-minute invitation to a 4th of July BBQ yesterday, given by my maid of honor in my upcoming wedding and some of her neighbors and her brother, etc. My fiance had to work yesterday night so he didn't come.

Anyways, from the beginning of the BBQ to the end, different friends (though not my MOH) came up to me with various pieces of advice and opinions on my life and life choices and situation.

1. First, my MOH's boyfriend came up to me and was talking about what he was thinking of getting her in terms of an engagement ring. He says he wants to have it specially made with symbolic things around it. And... he insults MY ring! He goes, "Do you really like yours?" (making a face) "I mean, can you see yourself wearing it forever?" (Me: "Uh... yes." It's 1 karat solitaire with some diamonds on the band, white gold, dainty). Then he asks what metals my ring has, and I reply white gold, and he says, "Well, I hear platinum is better and more expensive." And he asked me where my fiance went to get the ring and I said where and he goes, "I want to go to a REAL jewelry store." ... I have a natural diamond and the ring cost like $2500... which is more than I could ever ask for AND he DID go to a 'real jewelry store' ... I figured maybe everything he was saying was just coming out wrong, but later...

2. People one by one kept coming up to me saying things like, "Wow, we all really like your fiance. I mean, we expected him to be a real jerk, but he seems like he really loves you" and sort of variations on that. (Me: "Uhhh...")

3. My MOH's brother, whom I've known since childhood, then takes me aside and says, "I hope Im not overstepping my bounds, but I don't like your mother and I think she's too controlling of you. She's making all the decisions for the wedding, I heard, and that isn't right." When I told him that *I* have decided everything for the wedding, he didn't believe me. He apologized and apologized for "overstepping" but... I have to say, that hurt me. My mother *IS* controlling, or she tries to be, but I make my own decisions. And who just comes out and says they don't like someone's mother?

4. My MOH's boyfriend comes BACK over to me and starts talking to me for a llong time,m about marriage and relationships and MY relationship. At first it seemed like he was looking for some insight into like... engagement and marriage and such from me (since I've been legally married to my fiance for 2 years; we're just getting a religious ceremony and having a party in October). So I was willing to talk to him, but at one point he says: "You know, I can really see why your fiance loves you. I mean, there are more important things in the world than physical beauty, and you're interesting and funny and intelligent, so I can see why he loves you. And you know, to him, I bet you're the most beautiful girl in the world." ... ... ... look, I always have and ALWAYS WILL consider myself beastly. Always. But to know that othr people, my FRIENDS, think I am too... that is hurtful to me.

5. Then, during the same conversation, he tells me my fiance has gotten fat since he came to the US and that "it must be all the stress your mother is putting on him." ... BUT THIS GUY IS TWICE AS FAT AS MY FIANCE! My fiance has gained some weight, but he is *far* from fat. HE was actually a little too skinny when he first came here and he's used to eating like a bear and not gaining weight like he did in Europe (totally different ballgame in the US).

6. About three different people mentioned to me that they're only saying XYZ because they're "protective of me." ... I am perfectly capable of caring for myself, deciding things for myself, doing what I want and handling situations. No one needs to be protective of me!

So... from all of this, I have concluded the following:

- These people all think that I am so weak-willed and unable to make my own decisions that they 1. ASSUMED my fiance couldn't possible be a good person; that he'd have to be some @sshole who bosses me around or is mean to me or something, becuase I couldn't *POSSIBLY* be smart/savvy enough to choose someone who really loves me. 2. that I'm so weak and unable to decide things for myself that I just let my mother walk all over me, decide things for me about my wedding (my mother DOES think I'm completely incapable of doing anything, and she does TRY to push me around, but I don't let her). 3. I need protection from my own weaknesses.

- They all think my engagement ring is no good? (this hurts me FOR my fiance... the ring is really lovely and it's a very good quality stone).

- They all think I'm ugly but that my fiance loves me anyway (bless his heart, what a saint).

- They assume my family is monsterous, especially my mother, and they dislike my family.

The thing is, although I do hearily consider myself ugly, I do *NOT* agree with ANYTHING else here, especially the part about me being weak/incapable/easily dominated. I *HATE* the idea that people consider me this way; I've been sick about this all morning because *I* consider myself an exceptionally strong person and I consider myself VERY able to make decisions for myself and care for myself. I just hate the idea that they're all sitting there assuming that I'm so wishy-washy that I let my parents (and fiance too, probably) treat me like garbage, boss me around and do everything for me.

I am a person who lost around 80lbs, I traveled to Europe, by myself, and stayed there for months, by myself. I met the nicest guy i've ever met while there, I maintained a long distance relationship with him for two years, I tackled US immigration to bring him here, I decided to get married when I was 22 so he could stay, I got my BA and now I'm working on my MA (all A's, of course) and I want to get my PhD someday too. I have a full-time job but I have made the decision, based on what is right for me, to switch careers. What about that seems weak? Is it bc I am a nice person, and I don't act like a "b***h" and yell and scream and demand things? Maybe I should be more like that...

Ugh... I'm sorry to RANT. If you've actually read this whole thing, I give you credit lol. I just don't know what to do... I feel SICK about this, and mad and hurt. I wasn't expecting anything like this, at a party, from FRIENDS.


shelby897
07-05-2008, 06:17 PM
:hug: I give you a lot of credit -- I think I would have gone home after about the second or third mindless spewing of "verbal vomit" from these people!! I am all for telling people your opinion, as I personally don't want to be stabbed in the back, just tell me to my face -- but apparently they all felt the need to make sure you knew their true feelings all in one day! :hug: (another hug for good measure)!!

You know what, now you know their opinions -- but it shouldn't matter -- the only person that has an opinion that matters to me is my husband and my family -- that's it!! Just curious -- I'm kind of hoping 1/2 of these weanies were drunk???!!!:dizzy:

I know you can't not let it bother you -- but I wouldn't let it drag you down for too long -- you know what a wonderful man you are going to marry, you know your mother can be controlling but you also know how to tone her down, etc.

My sister's step-daughter who was about 7 years old when they got married asked me (in front of my poor sister) why my diamond was so much bigger than hers.... I told Victoria that her dad had two wonderful children to offer my sister, my husband had nothing so he had to buy me a bigger ring :D.

Just remember -- next year when/if they invite you to the BBQ on the 4th -- go watch the fireworks by yourself instead! And, if most of these people are at your wedding, be sure to have a few comments ready to throw back at them, after all you owe them!!

chick_in_the_hat
07-05-2008, 06:42 PM
:hug:All I can say is "what a bunch of morons". I was hoping at least one of them had the excuse of being drunk as well.

I do have a question...why do you heartily consider myself ugly.?

Sounds to me like you have quite a bit going for you.


bargoo
07-05-2008, 06:57 PM
With friends like this you don't need enemies. What a bunch of ill mannered, rude jerks!

KLK
07-05-2008, 06:57 PM
Hi -- just for the record, there WAS drinking, but imo none of these people were drunk during our little conversations. Thank you for your words of support. Their opinions really shouldn't matter to me, but it's just hurtful to think your *FRIENDS* think this way about you. Yeesh...

Chick in the Hat -- thank you for your kind words. To answer your question... I *do* consider myself a person with a lot going for her, but physical beauty is not one of those things. There are times when I feel I look better than usual, but generally, I don't think I'm pretty or anything. That's not to say that I can't be ATTRACTIVE... as my MoH's boyfriend suggested yesterday, there is more to attraction than physical beauty (good news for me, huh?), but in terms of just pure physical appearance, I consider myself well below-average. That my friend actively confirmed these feelings... (out of sensitivity, one must lie about such things imo)... makes me cringe.

Bunti
07-05-2008, 07:49 PM
"I am a person who lost around 80lbs, I traveled to Europe, by myself, and stayed there for months, by myself. I met the nicest guy i've ever met while there, I maintained a long distance relationship with him for two years, I tackled US immigration to bring him here, I decided to get married when I was 22 so he could stay, I got my BA and now I'm working on my MA (all A's, of course) and I want to get my PhD someday too. I have a full-time job but I have made the decision, based on what is right for me, to switch careers. What about that seems weak? Is it bc I am a nice person, and I don't act like a "b***h" and yell and scream and demand things? Maybe I should be more like that..."

You may not be able to hear this yet, but they are all JEALOUS of you. Look at all the things you have done, that take nerve, willpower, smarts and dedication. Now that you have lost weight, and are continuing to succeed at many levels, you are somehow threatening to your "friends". The physical stuff is about weight.....not anything else-- you are being so successful that for some reason they need to bring you down. They don't think you are weak. They need to say such things to feel better about not being as successful as you. A sad thing is that things like losing weight, or finding success does sometimes lose us friends. Especially if they used to use our circumstances, whatever they were/are to make themselves feel superior somehow.

I am sorry this happened to you.

PhotoChick
07-05-2008, 07:54 PM
I have to ask ... since so many of these people seem to have the same perception ... and since obviously by your description you are NONE of the things they are saying ...

There must be something going on that is giving them that perception.

Do you find yourself complaining about your mom or your situation to your MOH or other friends? Do you find yourself saying things about your fiance or about your self image to those people?

I find it really hard to believe that multiple people would come up with those kinds of things if there wasn't something that you had said or done (even unconsciously) to lead them to believe you felt that way about those things.

I dunno. People can be jerks (lord knows) but I know sometimes I've vented to a friend about something that was really annoying me at the time and then later that friend has come back and made some pretty hurtful comments about a personal situation ... and I had to realize that I actually planted that seed myself by not being careful about what I was venting about.

My best friend actually thinks my guy is a jerk ... she doesn't say so often but every once in a while she reminds me that she doesn't think he's good enough for me ... because of a situation where I was really upset with him and went to her for a shoulder. I never should have done that because she will NEVER see him in a good light ever again ... and it is hurtful. But I created the situation and now I have to live with it.

I'm just wondering if something like that might have nappened with you and your friends?

.

GradPhase
07-05-2008, 08:16 PM
That's a good point PhotoChick - my first thought was that maybe the MOH was really worried about you and talked to a few people about it - so when they finally saw you they all felt it was so important they should say something, too.

Either way, I'm really sorry your feelings were hurt. I hope your heart mends soon. People can be so... well.. imperfect. Feel better soon.

Sassy_Chick
07-05-2008, 09:48 PM
All I gotta say is "Opinions are like :censored: everybody's got one"

Its YOUR life and if your happy with it, that is all that matters. Nobody elses opinion matters!

:hug:

chick_in_the_hat
07-05-2008, 10:11 PM
Chick in the Hat -- thank you for your kind words. To answer your question... I *do* consider myself a person with a lot going for her, but physical beauty is not one of those things. There are times when I feel I look better than usual, but generally, I don't think I'm pretty or anything. That's not to say that I can't be ATTRACTIVE... as my MoH's boyfriend suggested yesterday, there is more to attraction than physical beauty (good news for me, huh?), but in terms of just pure physical appearance, I consider myself well below-average. That my friend actively confirmed these feelings... (out of sensitivity, one must lie about such things imo)... makes me cringe.

I totally hear ya. And upon reflection I can honestly say I wouldn't call myself pretty but more like HAWT. :s: I'm not expecting to win America's Next Top Model, but I have a confidence I didn't used to have. :cool: I do have faith in the power of positive thinking. I guess maybe my question should be something more along the lines of what's the point of tearing yourself down?

The jealousy theory is a good one IMHO.

KLK
07-05-2008, 11:18 PM
You make a good point, Photochick. I don't remember any specific occasion I complained about my mother being controlling but my MoH's family and mine have been neighbors for YEARS (we're friends since we were kids) so they know her general M.O.. Part of it might be some complaining that I've done in the past, but I think part of it might be them have a static impression of me. These people (for the most part) all knew me from when I was very little, saw me grow up into a confidence-free fat kid and be that way for the majority of my life. I lost weight, but I think there's a bit of a disconnect between my obvious physical changes and my less obvious personality changes, that maybe they don't see (fully). Maybe they think the fat girl who's too afraid of being made fun of to speak her mind is getting married now? Not the case, but maybe that's what they think?

But I don't think I've ever complained ab my fiance, at all, and I definitely never complained about my engagement ring. I think their initial apprehension about him *might* stem from the fact that he's from Albania -- Albanians here have a reputation for being pretty bad-@ss. My fiance is the sweetest person ever, but his countrymen...they can be rough. But part of it, I think, is there perception of me as this helpless, wishy-washy creature, the perpetual Fat Girl, who can never take care of herself.

I honestly don't know where the engagement ring stuff came from... they just don't like my ring? (personally, the 'specially made' ring her bf was describing to be sounded like it would be HIDEOUS should it ever come into being, but of course, I wouldn't *say* that ;) and I personally think my MoH would prefer something closer to what I have).

I'm actually really careful about what I say, especially ab my fiance, to other people, even friends, just for this reason. Friends can have LOOOOOONG memories for this kind of thing and, from experience i've learned, arguments and fights *you* have forgotten in your own relationship aren't easily forgotten by friends you complained to. Ironically, my MoH complains to me A LOT ab her boyfriend (he's insanely jealous).

I have to ask ... since so many of these people seem to have the same perception ... and since obviously by your description you are NONE of the things they are saying ...

There must be something going on that is giving them that perception.

Do you find yourself complaining about your mom or your situation to your MOH or other friends? Do you find yourself saying things about your fiance or about your self image to those people?

I find it really hard to believe that multiple people would come up with those kinds of things if there wasn't something that you had said or done (even unconsciously) to lead them to believe you felt that way about those things.

I dunno. People can be jerks (lord knows) but I know sometimes I've vented to a friend about something that was really annoying me at the time and then later that friend has come back and made some pretty hurtful comments about a personal situation ... and I had to realize that I actually planted that seed myself by not being careful about what I was venting about.

My best friend actually thinks my guy is a jerk ... she doesn't say so often but every once in a while she reminds me that she doesn't think he's good enough for me ... because of a situation where I was really upset with him and went to her for a shoulder. I never should have done that because she will NEVER see him in a good light ever again ... and it is hurtful. But I created the situation and now I have to live with it.

I'm just wondering if something like that might have nappened with you and your friends?

.

KLK
07-05-2008, 11:28 PM
Hi Bunti -- thank you. I dunno if theyre jealous of me. Maybe they are, but these friends and I always seemed to have a sort of different set of priorities(I'm more conservative, driven academically, conventional), so I dunno if they're really jealous... from an objective standpoint, I am the most 'together' person, but with this specific group, I don't know if that is grounds for jealousy lol.

"I am a person who lost around 80lbs, I traveled to Europe, by myself, and stayed there for months, by myself. I met the nicest guy i've ever met while there, I maintained a long distance relationship with him for two years, I tackled US immigration to bring him here, I decided to get married when I was 22 so he could stay, I got my BA and now I'm working on my MA (all A's, of course) and I want to get my PhD someday too. I have a full-time job but I have made the decision, based on what is right for me, to switch careers. What about that seems weak? Is it bc I am a nice person, and I don't act like a "b***h" and yell and scream and demand things? Maybe I should be more like that..."

You may not be able to hear this yet, but they are all JEALOUS of you. Look at all the things you have done, that take nerve, willpower, smarts and dedication. Now that you have lost weight, and are continuing to succeed at many levels, you are somehow threatening to your "friends". The physical stuff is about weight.....not anything else-- you are being so successful that for some reason they need to bring you down. They don't think you are weak. They need to say such things to feel better about not being as successful as you. A sad thing is that things like losing weight, or finding success does sometimes lose us friends. Especially if they used to use our circumstances, whatever they were/are to make themselves feel superior somehow.

I am sorry this happened to you.

chickybird
07-05-2008, 11:47 PM
KLK, I'd love to see a picture of you. I bet you are pretty,simply because you glow with confidence. A few years ago, I felt the same way you do about my appearance. I hated being tall, lanky, clumsy, etc. Sorry for being nosy, but it drives me wild to see otherwise confident, competent women downing themselves. Sorry you were surrounded be jerks! :hug:

PhotoChick
07-05-2008, 11:47 PM
These people (for the most part) all knew me from when I was very little, saw me grow up into a confidence-free fat kid and be that way for the majority of my life. I lost weight, but I think there's a bit of a disconnect between my obvious physical changes and my less obvious personality changes, that maybe they don't see (fully). Maybe they think the fat girl who's too afraid of being made fun of to speak her mind is getting married now? Not the case, but maybe that's what they think?
I think that's very perceptive on your part. I know it doesn't make the situation any less hurtful, but yeah, I can see where it fits in.

I am sorry that you're having to deal with this and yeah, I'm not sure exactly where the engagement ring thing fits in, except that there might be an element of jealousy there? Dunno. Ther also might be a little of the fear of the unknown on their part. Accepting a fiance/husband from a foreign country into their world might be scary to them. It's hard for some people to move past stereotypes and to accept people as individuals.

I know how hurtful it can be ... the best advice I have (such as it is) is hang inthere and know that whatever relationship you and your fiance have is very personal and something that no one else will ever know the depth of.

FWIW, I think, based on what you've told us, you're a pretty amazing person and one who I would love to get to know better!!!

.

Operator265
07-06-2008, 12:02 AM
First, What the **** is MOH!!!!:shrug:

Second. Change is scary. In ourselves it's kinda scary, but in others around us, it's REALLY SCARY. It leads to intraspection, and that is uncomfortable for anyone. Some of us react by looking in and being happy to grow. MOST of us freak out.:fr: It's human nature. It is very easy to be defensive.

You're friends seem to being seeing a little girl who has grown up. Not easy to deal with. My mom had to deal with it once I had my own children and the power shifted. Not easy to watch her baby walk away and become a woman and a mother. I had my moments of lack of confidence, but I overcame them.

You know what you are!!! You are now a WOMAN!!! Everyone else will have to accept it and move on.

marbleflys
07-06-2008, 02:49 PM
MOH= maid of Honor....

these people are your friends? no, they seem to be jealous of you. You are sounding incredibly accomplished and self-sufficient. You've outgrown them by leaps and bounds.

congratulations on rising above them, i don't know if i would have been able to keep from smacking them.

walking2lose
07-06-2008, 03:30 PM
MOH's boyfriend sounds atrocious. I mean, truly, you should be the one worrying about her. He is not only rude; he is clearly shallow. I have a gorgeous white gold ring that DH and I had made. I had input and all that, but he is the one who bought. I loved it then, and I love it now. I had a few of my high school students comment that the diamonds are small (???? it's NOT a chintzy ring by any stretch), but I took that with a grain of salt because they only know huge gaudy cubic zirconias or what hip hop artists wear... anyway, as long as you love your ring, forget other opinions.

As for the rest, good luck. I hope all these people won't be at your wedding.

lisaslost
07-06-2008, 04:35 PM
WOW! We are made to think that there is only one type of beauty. And that is a very sad thing. I am sure you are a very beautiful woman. You might not like every thing you see when you look in the mirror, but then who does. Look at all the great qualitys you have is it hair, eyes, mouth, nose, teeth or lips etc. fall in love with that part of you. And then you will see the rest is just as beautiful. And your doing a great on the weight loss. I hope to reach that someday soon.


And as for the ring my late husband Angelo (God rest his soul) had purchased my wedding band from a local art fair. It was made of some kind of metal, silver I think, he had it hand made. It was made of two separate lengths woven around each other and knotted. He said it was like us bound together forever. And I would have never replace that ring with the biggest diamond (ok well maybe the biggest one lol) in the world. It came from what he thought of our relationship. It came from his heart. ( Angelo passed in 1996).


Just one more thing before I go I am sorry for rambling on. I once dated a man who was burned over 90% of his body face included. But I was in love with him. He was so perfect and wonderful. And when I looked at him I never even seen the scars. When we went someplace together I was proud to hold his hand. To let everyone know that we were as one. And I am sure people talked, because thats how people are. But my love for him was so deep that nothing they said could even make me give it a second thought. I saw beauty in him. The most beautiful man I had ever laid eyes on. We all don't look the same and we are lucky like that. Thats what makes us all BEAUTIFUL.

And one more thing I know what I said sorry again. About your mom, yeah she wants to be in control. 1 its your mom. And moms are always the boss. Didn't they ever hear because I'm the mom thats why. 2 she wants every thing to be perfect for your wedding. 3 your blessed to have a mom. :)

KLK
07-06-2008, 08:06 PM
Dear Everyone,

Thank you for your replies. I feel better today, having read them, but I am still kind of angry -- it's just not the kind of treatment you expect ALL NIGHT LONG from a group of longtime friends (and people who aren't technically friends, but friends of friends). Luckily, not everyone at this party will be at my wedding, though some will of course.

I actually don't have any photos of myself on this computer, but I would post one if I did. Actually, if I can find one later today, I will scan it.

PhotoChick -- I'd like to know more ab you too! You also seem extremely confident and self-possessed :D

Walkingtolose -- I don't see ANYTHING wrong with white gold. It's GOLD for goodness sake! lol. And it's actually a heartier metal than platinum and scratches less easily, which is what I told my MoH's boyfriend (not that I should have to defend my ring to him, of course). I think the issue with him is that *he* is border-line obsessed with my MoH (in a kind of unhealthy way), he spends extravagantly on her, literally spending his whole paycheck to take her to the Bahamas or something. My fiance and I are MUCH less la-dee-da; we pay bills, buy groceries, etc etc. lol. I think my MoH's boyfriend lavishes her with gifts bc he thinks he has to to keep her around; my fiance spent MORE than I could have ever expected and it's a beautiful ring that I love and he didn't buy it for me because he was afraid I'd leave him if he didnt. My MoH's bf is EXTREMELY jealous, too, and possessive, and out of shape and my MoH's forever flirting with other guys and telling him he needs to lose weight. AND... it turns out... she's always saying how cute my fiance is to her boyfriend (seriously sort of like an "Ahh... if only MY bf was so cute"). So maybe that has something to do with it, which I didn't realize. And that is a mean mind-game to play on her bf, but it isn't MY fault or my fiance's (he can't help his cuteness ;)).

Lisaslost -- I'm so sorry you lost your husband! Just from that post alone I could tell how much you're in love with him. The ring he had made for you sounds beautiful; that kind of symbolism, too, is lovely. THAT is a nice ring; the specially made ring my MoH's boyfriend was describing to me just seemed like it would be big and odd and actually kind of manly.

Amy8888
07-07-2008, 11:28 AM
I'm not going to address the various deep self-esteem issues, because everyone else seems to be doing a great job of that. I just wanted to say that your ring sounds lovely. It sound like mine actually, and I get a lot of compliments on it. I can't imagine anyone putting it down...one karat is a good size! And I went with white gold as well. A jeweler even told us to go with that over platinum because it's more durable, and this is someone who would PROFIT from us purchasing platinum.

KLK
07-07-2008, 11:34 AM
Thanks! Your ring sounds lovely too -- I always liked the look of a solitaire round diamond for an engagement ring.

And actually, my ring has gotten quite a few random comments from people. I was in Modell's trying on sneakers once and a woman randomly came up and said my ring is one of the most beautiful she'd ever seen. My fiance also got me a matching diamond wedding band too. I'm very happy with the set.

Yep -- Ive heard the same thing ab white gold v. platinum in terms of durability. And both metals APPEAR equally nice, imo.

I just *UGH* think it's so crappy to insult someone's engagement ring, even if you think it is fugly... Really, the ring this guy was describing wanting to have made for her sounds like it would be horrendously ugly, but if he got it for her and she loved it, I would say it's beautiful.

I'm not going to address the various deep self-esteem issues, because everyone else seems to be doing a great job of that. I just wanted to say that your ring sounds lovely. It sound like mine actually, and I get a lot of compliments on it. I can't imagine anyone putting it down...one karat is a good size! And I went with white gold as well. A jeweler even told us to go with that over platinum because it's more durable, and this is someone who would PROFIT from us purchasing platinum.

JulieJ08
07-07-2008, 12:00 PM
I just *UGH* think it's so crappy to insult someone's engagement ring, even if you think it is fugly

And that is just the bottom line about that one. All the other stuff people said, maybe jealousy or other things were involved. But this man was just plain nasty rude.

Hat Trick
07-07-2008, 01:46 PM
There is simply no way around the fact that some people are, and always will be, stupid! The MOH's bf? Egads!! Knock him in the head w/a brick! What a moronic, thoughtless, ignorant, little man he is.

Your ring sounds beautiful. My engagement ring is also a solitaire diamond set in gold. I've always held to the notion that less is more.

I cannot fathom that so many people think it was ok to come up to you and insult you, your ring, your brain, your fiance, etc. What the heck is wrong w/these folks? Maybe they were drunker than they appeared!

I've never, ever gotten that 'beauty is external' thing. I've seen really pretty people who were the most obnoxious jerks ever and less than pretty people who were simply terrific, fantastic people. You sound FANTASTIC to me and I wish you all the best of luck w/your wedding and your life!!

Ok, I have to ask -- what does 'HAWT' stand for?