20-Somethings - Friend Problems - am I in junior high again??? (OT - and really longggggggg)

05-07-2008, 10:10 AM
Soooooooo, in addition to having a VERY slow go with weight loss lately (i've only lost 1 LB in three weeks), I'm having major friend drama.

I have a couple close groups of friends, and one friend (a guy), spans both of these groups. I've known him for over three years now, and we are really great pals. I know it's kinda weird to claim a guy as a best friend, especially when you're dating someone else, but I do. He has told me over and over how important our friendship is to him and how much he enjoys hanging out with me.

So, that's a little background, but here's some more: two other important characters in this tale of woe. A girl that I met at work a couple years back who I've become absolutely awesome pals with, and another girl from that same job who I work with now at a different job (I referred her to my current workplace and she got hired). The girl I currently work with, let's call her "Rachel", is thinnish, considers herself very attractive and holds herself in extremely high regard (read: huge ego). I tend to gravitate toward modesty, but since we share the mutual friendship of Girl A ("Sarah"), we became friends. But over the past year of working together, there has definitely been an overload for me. She has no problem telling me that I look fat or I shouldn't be wearing those shoes or my car is a piece of junk. She says stupid, pointless, insulting things constantly, but normally I just considered the source and let it roll off.

[If you're still reading this, you get an imaginary gold star!!! :dizzy: ]

So, about a month ago, while Rachel, Sarah, and one of Sarah's out of town friends were at lunch, Rachel made a comment that turned out to be the final straw for me. We were all talking about people who drop off the face of the earth when they start dating someone, and how we can't stand it. She attacked me mid-conversation, for no reason, saying that she "can't understand" my relationship and "there's something wrong with you" just because my boyfriend has an EXTREMELY busy schedule between work and school and sometimes I only see him a couple times a week. I found this highly embarrassing but didn't want to lose my cool in front of Sarah's friend from out of town, so I confronted Rachel about it at work the following day. All I wanted was an apology, but instead I got a defense of what she had said. "Don't ask for my advice if you don't want it." Umm, I wasn't asking for ANY advice, a##!

Sooooo, here's where my guy friend comes in. He and Rachel have a history of hating eachother. She constantly *****ed about how she couldn't stand to be around him, how she thought he was so unattractive, etc. So I find out from Sarah about a week after I stopped talking to Rachel that Rachel and my guy friend had been "hanging out" on a few occasions.

This infuriated me.

So I confronted him about it, and he said that it has nothing to do with loyalty to me, and just because Rachel and I aren't speaking doesn't mean he can't hang out with her (i'm still trying to gauge whether "hanging out" means as friends, hooking up, dating...). I know I might be sounding a bit possessive, but since they had absolutely no established friendship prior to our argument/friendship breakup, is it right for him to be doing this? Obviously he's not my boyfriend, and I have no right to tell him what to do. It just hurts me SO BADLY, and feels like such a betrayal.

He retorts that "Sarah still hangs out with Rachel. Why aren't you mad at Sarah? Why am I the only one who's not being loyal?" The differences abound: she's not trying to date/hook up with Rachel, and Rachel and Sarah were friends before I even knew Rachel. Even though Sarah is a very close friend, I wouldn't expect her to take sides. But with him, it's different.

Or is it? Am I being crazy? As 8th grade as this all sounds, it has literally been making me sick. I don't want to lose my entire group of friends over this, but I really can't stand being around him now knowing that he's associating with her. He said that he doesn't want our friendship to end, but he's not going to stop hanging out with her, and it'll be on me if I can't handle it. :(:?::?:

I'm so sad.

05-07-2008, 10:18 AM
I don't think Rachel is a friend. And why sre you feeling possesive over guy friend ? Just a couple of thoughts that crossed my mind.

05-07-2008, 10:21 AM
He has become - i dunno, like my little bro or something. And I know she has a history of hurting guys. And you're right - she's not a friend. I've made it clear that I don't want her in my life because all she brings me is negativity.

I guess i just feel if they would (God forbid) date and get serious about each other, my friendship with him would be over. But at the rate it's going now, it's going to be over anyways.

05-07-2008, 11:00 AM
Yuck, what a mess! I hate to say it, from from a rational point of view, I think your guy friend is right, he should be able to hang out with whoever he wants, its not fair for you to pick his friends (or girlfriends, if that is the case of what hes going for there). That said, I totally understand how much its gotta hurt to have this close friend of yours making buddies with the 'enemy'. I think if you're made your case known, about why you don't like this girl, why you don't think it would be a good idea for him to hook up with her/be friends/whatever, and he still wants to hang out with her, well... its kind of up to you how to handle it. I agree that if this girl has nothing but negative comments for you, its probably best to avoid her. But it seems like dropping your friendship with the guy would kind of be like cutting off your nose to spite your face. It seems to me that his importance to you should override your distaste of his relationship with "Rachel". Maybe it might be best for you to hang back for a little while and clear your head, and then reevaluate how you want to deal with these issues, once the hurt isn't so fresh it might be easier.

Marathon Mom
05-07-2008, 11:01 AM
Mickey - I can relate to how you feel....

You have your team (Sarah and "the Guy") and you want them to see things the way you do - since they're on your 'team'. So when they are being friendly to Rachel - of course you feel betrayed. That's not possessive - that's just being a team.

Rachel has issues & you need to get rid of her

"The Guy" will come around.. because they are slower than chicks.. :) Be true to your friends and let the weird ones go...

(Thanks for the imaginary Gold Star - I love it!)

05-07-2008, 11:17 AM
I say - take a step back, breathe, and enjoy and live your life. Friends unfortunately come and go...especially the ones who aren't true friends to begin with. I think you realize that Rachel is not a friend and is no big loss to you anyways. As for your guy friend, give it a breather and things will work out the way they are supposed to. If he gets hurt by Rachel, then it was his fault going into the situation.

Good Luck!

05-07-2008, 11:28 AM
Hi Mickey--

I don't blame you for being hurt about the whole situation, but like Marathon Mom said,

["The Guy" will come around.. because they are slower than chicks.. ]

He's eventually going to see what a bonehead she is and then he'll know exactly why you're upset. Personally, I wouldn't think that he's even the one who's being a sh*t here--I'd be thinking that this Rachel chick has a problem with you--which is blatantly obvious--and she's only befriending him to piss you off. Which is working.

Now, that being said, if he wants to hang out with her he should be able to without it affecting your relationship with him. As long as he's not dogging you to her or making plans for all you to go out together then it shouldn't be an issue. I understand that your feelings are hurt, but he's only a friend and he can do what he wants, when he wants and with who he wants. As much as that knowledge absolutely stinks, that's the way it is. I'm sure you've had friends in the past who also hung out with people you didn't really care for and you just have to deal with it. :( Don't ruin a great friendship with your guy friend over this chick Rachel. She has already proven that she is so NOT worth it. Good luck and I hope the situation gets better for you soon.

05-07-2008, 11:30 AM
Been there, done that (in Jr. High, actually :) ). I agree with the others, just hang back and let it work itself out. The more you say in this situation the worse you'll make YOURSELF look. Don't even bring up Rachel's name when you're with your guy friend and/or Sarah, and if they bring her up, say something to the effect of "let's not talk about her."

Try not to gloat or say "I told you so" (too much) when things work out in your favor.

05-07-2008, 11:36 AM
I've been in this boat ~ the characters a little different, but the story still the same. And I will point out right up front that the guy and I are still very close friends. So breath! This will work out!
The thing is that I think you're looking for this guy to take sides because of how close you are AND because he's been a constant form of compliments and support. How in the world could someone as awesome as him be attracted to someone as lame as her? Because he's a GUY! There's nothing you can do about this, just like there'd be little or nothing he could do about your feelings about your boyfriend. People who are attracted to each other are attracted for reasons some people never get. And who knows? You may be completely off base - maybe he's not attracted to her at all and just enjoys her company as well. Thing is, it's not fair to be as territorial as you are being to him OR to you! You're creating stress for yourself and you have no control over other people's feelings. Take a step back and try to let him do what he wants to do. Because you're a good friend and also because you're an adult.
As far as Rachel goes - people like that never change. She'll be a a**hole her entire life...surely she has been thus far. People who can't go a day without insulting someone have issues of their own. If you give this girl anything at all...let it be pity!
Good luck with your weight loss and good luck with the boy!

05-07-2008, 11:42 AM
I don't think you need to worry aobut your relationship with your guy friend. Once he starts seeing Rachel on anything other than a completely casual basis, there's no way in **** she's going to let him hang out with you. At that point he's going to have to decide what's important to him, your friendship or getting laid.

She's a miserable human being that you're better off without. Never really a friend at all. Whether he's worth having around is still to be determined.

Unfortunately, this crap with friends and who's friends with whom and being "friends" with people who treat you like dirt, doesn't really end until you get into your late 30's when you realize that it's all too much trouble to deal with and you're too tired for it and would really rather take a nap. It's one of the real benefits to getting older; you don't take so much crap from people because you like having a group to hang out with.

Keep your head up.

05-07-2008, 11:51 AM
You've let this Rachel person go (and thank goodness from the sound of it). That's all that can be done.

Absolutely reverse this "taking sides" things. Because it honestly does make you look like you're in junior high.

Apologize to the guy friend. Tell him that he's right, it's not your business who he hangs out with. You were simply feeling a little hurt, but you're over it (even if you aren't) and you hope that nothing changes between the two of you.

Then never speak of Rachel again to him or to Sarah. Never bring her up. You will then come out of this smelling like roses :) The problem with bringing her up in conversation is that it then becomes clear just how NOT over it you are.

If you have to speak to someone about it, you do have a boyfriend. You also have us ;) I just cannot stress enough how important it is that once you're done with Rachel, you must be completely DONE with Rachel. Especially to people who still hang around her.

If they mention her, no need to even comment. It makes you look like a better person when you have nothing to say about her, neither good nor bad.

I say this from experience, because I have a friend "A" who dropped a friend of hers "B", they have a mutual friend "C". A will constantly talk to C to find out how B is doing. (And A always hopes miserably.) B has never said anything to C about A. Guess who seems to be over it? Even if B really isn't... I wouldn't know!

05-07-2008, 12:00 PM
I'm sorry this situation happened to you! :(

I think your guy friend is in the wrong, but my suggestion is that you still be the BETTER person. He is, in a way, putting Rachel before you, right?...BUT, in return you are also putting Rachel before him by focusing on her as a big part of your friendship now. Forget about Rachel! She is a sad soul.

If you have a good history of strong friendship with him, think about the good things instead of this one instance. He totally breached friendship support and trust with this one, but sometimes people are stupid and just need time to come around. If it becomes a pattern then I would distance myself more and more from that friendship. If this is a string of many things he's done like this, than perhaps this behaviour is not very surprising?

Anywho, thats my rubbish two cents. I hope these hurts and mended soon and your guy friend comes around! :)

05-07-2008, 12:00 PM
Unfortunately, this crap with friends and who's friends with whom and being "friends" with people who treat you like dirt, doesn't really end until you get into your late 30's when you realize that it's all too much trouble to deal with and you're too tired for it and would really rather take a nap. It's one of the real benefits to getting older; you don't take so much crap from people because you like having a group to hang out with.

Keep your head up.

HAHAH ROBIN! It's funny - I have an older guy friend at work (he's 55- me and my older men.hehe) who told me the same thing.

Everyone else: I REALLY appreciate your advice. You're all fantastic. I've decided that this weekend I'm going to take a little mental "retreat" and go visit my parents (esp. cause it's Mother's Day on Sunday). They live out in the country and since the weather has been great, it'll be a nice bit of R&R to be out in the sunshine in the fresh air! Maybe a campfire or two! I'm not "running away" from the situation, but some fam time this weekend might help me re-center and "step back" a bit (the BF said he'll miss me but he understands that I need this time).

Soooooo, I guess I'm going to approach it that way. Not say another word about it, do my best to be the best friend I can, and hopefully everything will work itself out. Thanks again!

05-07-2008, 12:05 PM
Soooooo, I guess I'm going to approach it that way. Not say another word about it, do my best to be the best friend I can, and hopefully everything will work itself out. Thanks again!

Yes yes yes! You've chosen a great approach. It might be hard :/ But you can talk about it here if you need to. MUCH better than to others IRL. :hug:

(And for what it's worth, we're on your team!)

Just Deb
05-07-2008, 12:24 PM
Good for you for walking away from a toxic friend. I think Rachel "huge ego" is based on her feeling "better" than someone else. And since you have removed yourself from that position her ego is wounded and she is looking to hurt you. Which is where your best friend comes in. Obviously she can be nice and friendly - she befriended you until you saw the real Rachel. Your friend will eventually see it too. It will just take a little time. In the meantime - be the bigger person and let him learn the lesson just as you did.

Robin in right - friends get easier when you are in your 30's. I think it is partly because experience teaches you choose them better and you learn to RUN from the toxic ones.

Hang in there - your friends will come around. I think you may be surprised by how much better you will feel about yourself now that you have removed the toxicity from your life.

05-07-2008, 02:11 PM
to go along with what everyone else is saying its always best to take the high road in these situations and do the classy thing.

Reguardless of your feelings toward Rachel I would not say anything negative about her to anyone and respect that the other 2 people want to hang out with her. Let them make judgements about Rachel based on how she treats them, not what you say....if she really is as flaky as you described they'll probably figure her out eventually.

I would also try and be as nice to Rachel as possible while at work...you can be civil and polite it does not mean you have to hang out with her and invite her over for dinner.