General chatter - Where Does This Idea Come From?




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srmb60
09-19-2007, 02:00 PM
You know ... we've read it here. "How can I lose weight if I don't like diet foods?" "I can never be thin ... I'm just not eating all that stuff."

What's your interpretation of the root of this?


junebug41
09-19-2007, 02:02 PM
Social norms, stereotypes and a fast food nation, in short. I'll come back with a better answer after lunch.

phantastica
09-19-2007, 02:06 PM
I think it has to do with how we're raised. Some people were never served vegetables when they were kids, so they never developed a taste for them. I'm always puzzled to meet people who have never eaten vegetables. I stare at them dumbfounded, wanting to check their pulse.

Some people have the same attitude towards whole-grain products, too!

Susan, what are your thoughts on it?


srmb60
09-19-2007, 02:12 PM
I wonder if some magical thinking is involved. Remember the tomato soup diet? the hard boiled egg diet? even meal replacement drink mixes? If I can just find the right combo ....

shelby897
09-19-2007, 02:18 PM
Because "diet" foods (vegetables, fruits, etc.) actually require work whereas a bag of cookies is one quick pull of the plastic and your in!!! :D But, I read somewhere that Dr. Phil (not exactly my favorite person but he's okay :)) said the more work it takes to prepare a food, the better it is for you. Which tends to be true, pealing an apple is more work than chowing on french friends from McD's!!

K8-EEE
09-19-2007, 02:19 PM
ADVERTISING!!! We are all marketed to constantly, til you get programmed that they need to buy magic products, or else be fat....I'm really trying to lose that mindset....I won't even buy a Diet Coke anymore! I used to guzzle the stuff and one day I looked at the ingredients label and was like, uh, why do I put this in my body??

The diet pill commercials on cable TV really crack me up. "Please don't respond to this ad if you only have a few pounds to lose - this is only for SERIOUS dieters!" Oh brother....as IF they won't take your credit card # if you're not fat or serious enough?

The weight loss industry ironically, is incredibly fat and bloated!!

In reality you don't have to buy a thing to lose weight. You have to consume LESS not MORE!

junebug41
09-19-2007, 02:22 PM
ADVERTISING!!! We are all marketed to constantly, til you get programmed that they need to buy magic products, or else be fat....I'm really trying to lose that mindset....I won't even buy a Diet Coke anymore! I used to guzzle the stuff and one day I looked at the ingredients label and was like, uh, why do I put this in my body??

The diet pill commercials on cable TV really crack me up. "Please don't respond to this ad if you only have a few pounds to lose - this is only for SERIOUS dieters!" Oh brother....as IF they won't take your credit card # if you're not fat or serious enough?

The weight loss industry ironically, is incredibly fat and bloated!!

In reality you don't have to buy a thing to lose weight. You have to consume LESS not MORE!

ding ding ding ding ding! It's all about fitting it into a nicely wrapped, marketable package.

modkittn
09-19-2007, 02:44 PM
I think for some people, they are comfortable eating the foods they eat now. They taste good to them, and they know that they like those foods. If I spent years eating junk and never ate a single vegetable, I'd feel a little odd about having to switch from my "normal" eating to something I rarely eat and eat that thing a lot more.

Luminous
09-19-2007, 03:15 PM
I think it's the mindset that you have to eat rabbit food or foods you dislike to lose weight. Because of that, people think you eat cabbage soup for a while, lose the weight, and then you're done. Then the plan is to eat what you ate before and cross your fingers—usually with good intentions like "I will eat what I used to, just less of it" or "I'll just never eat a cookie again."

The kicker is, how can they expect to portion control the foods they love, or never eat a certain food again, if they haven't been practicing it all along?

I trained for a marathon once. The long daily walks were a blip in my normal behavior. I never expected to walk 10 miles a day for the rest of my life, and I never expected to magically maintain the same level of fitness once I stopped. The diet food mentality seems like marathon training—switching to a different mode for a shortish while, but without the realization that it's going to be temporary.

And I totally don't get people who don't like vegetables at all! My friend's sister is like that. Like...how do you...function?

jtammy
09-19-2007, 03:38 PM
ADVERTISING!!! We are all marketed to constantly, til you get programmed that they need to buy magic products, or else be fat....I'm really trying to lose that mindset....I won't even buy a Diet Coke anymore! I used to guzzle the stuff and one day I looked at the ingredients label and was like, uh, why do I put this in my body??


I absolutely agree! Advertising is at work here, I think. We are innundated with advertising from things like Relacore, Jenny Craig, Nutrisystem, TrimSpa. (I'm not knocking these programs, I'm just saying that you can hardly turn on the TV without seeing an ad.) Remember Ayds diet candy from the 70s and Dexatrim from the 80s? So many people have tried diets and failed and some have assumed that their failure was because they didn't "buy" some program or product they saw advertised on tv. Even here at 3FC, it's pretty common to see a new poster lamenting that she can't afford Jennie Craig/ LA Weight Loss/ or some other food delivery service. They seem to feel that is the only way to lose weight.

Susan, I think a "magic combination" is another part of the reason. At one time that "magic combination" was no-fat, regardless of the calorie count. A few years later, it was "low-carb". It seems like we, as a society, are always looking for the magic (combination, pill, food, etc.)

deedee10
09-19-2007, 04:14 PM
jtammy, I think you hit the nail on the head with your comment about how the "magic combination" is forever changing. It's either low fat, counting calories, low-carb or some new diet aid and I think to myself, when will it all stop. I'm in awe of the French (and I mentioned that I am a lot on this site) and when I visited Paris and Monaco last April I was in awe of French women. I stayed with a friend who moved from the States for job reasons and when I saw her, she was 60 pounds lighter and looked like a completely different woman. She had picked up the habits that so many French women practice and they are basically eat lots of veges and fruits, chicken & fish and maybe beef once a week and portion size is a big deal plus walk everywhere. Amazingly, we could not find many low-fat products in the local markets and when I pumped some of her French friends about what they thought about diet aids some of them didn't know what I was talking about. When I came back to the states, it didn't take me long to get caught up in all of the weight loss/diet hype and think about what diet am I going to use now to lose my last 20 pounds. I even started the low carb thing and then missed my french tarten in the morning and said forget it - so I'm sticking with the French way - watch portion size, eat a large variety of foods - dessert once a week and make it something really decadent and worthwhile - and move that body!

HeatherAngel
09-19-2007, 04:35 PM
DeeDee, your post made me laugh - I spent six years in France, and in that time I met many happy, healthy but fairly chubby French women. I met ONE thin French woman in Paris (out of many) who DID NOT drink espresso and smoke unfiltered cigarettes. I hated shopping in Paris - nothing fit me. I always secretly hoped *I* could learn to love espresso and unfiltered cigarettes... :lol3:

Generally though, it is absolutely true. We live in a 'quick-fix' society - and I have watched people tune out after they ask me how I am losing weight... they don't want to know that I am controlling what goes in my mouth and how much I exercise. Recently, a lady in a shop asked me (I kid you not!) - "Why didn't you just get the surgery?" I left.

EZMONEY
09-19-2007, 05:15 PM
Personally I think that the "root' of al of this is...now don't get'cher panties in a wad.....WE ARE LAZY ~ WE ARE SPOILED ~ WE WANT IT and WE WANT IT NOW :tantrum: The easy way is to drive up to a place that cooked :chef: it for you The easy way is to let the "fat" dog walk himself...he deserves it...I gave him plenty of :cookie: cookies to shut him up, while I watched another Jerry Springer The easy way is to :cry: WHINE .. oh poor woe is me :cry: and get a :hug: without doing anything!

Now in NO WAY do I think this applies to everyone. I know there are a lot of "issues" out there...one reason this 3FC site is so successful...but....WE are a lazy people....that's just MY take on it!

JayEll
09-19-2007, 05:27 PM
Well, some diet plans really are pretty bland and yucky. I was on a plan once where it was egg-white omelets most mornings. I hate egg whites, and there is really no reason not to eat a whole egg. Also, the plan had lots of turkey breast for lunch or dinner. I used to like turkey breast, but not anymore! :p

On the other end of the scale are the plans where you have to be cooking all the time. I'm just not there... I don't want to spend a lot of time every day making my food. Yeah, that could be considered lazy--but mostly I think it's my own preference!

So, I count calories, and I pretty much have come up with how to eat and what to eat, and it's all stuff I like to eat--but of course I have restrictions! I don't believe there is any way for someone to lose weight without some sort of food restrictions.

I also don't believe there is any way to avoid regaining weight lost without some sort of food restrictions.

Like EZ said, we want it and we want it now. Lots of people are just "big children" that way--and I was one of them! People equate "restrictions" with being unhappy, and that's not what it is. It's being an adult and knowing the laws of physics. No, I can't sit down and eat a pint of ice cream unless I'm prepared to do those 8,000 jumping jacks!

Jay

4myloves
09-19-2007, 05:28 PM
Personally I think that the "root' of al of this is...now don't get'cher panties in a wad.....WE ARE LAZY ~ WE ARE SPOILED ~ WE WANT IT and WE WANT IT NOW :tantrum: The easy way is to drive up to a place that cooked :chef: it for you The easy way is to let the "fat" dog walk himself...he deserves it...I gave him plenty of :cookie: cookies to shut him up, while I watched another Jerry Springer The easy way is to :cry: WHINE .. oh poor woe is me :cry: and get a :hug: without doing anything!

Now in NO WAY do I think this applies to everyone. I know there are a lot of "issues" out there...one reason this 3FC site is so successful...but....WE are a lazy people....that's just MY take on it!


Dang, there Gary goes talking about himself and his pet mouse again :)

phantastica
09-19-2007, 05:35 PM
Personally WE ARE LAZY ~ WE ARE SPOILED ~ WE WANT IT and WE WANT IT NOW :tantrum:

WHAT? Spoiled, lazy, immediate gratification? In America? I thought those were written into the Bill of Rights! ;)

I totally agree. We don't have to work hard for anything ... at least, not in the ways previous generations have had to work. My step-mother drives her car ONE BLOCK to her job every day, even in beautiful weather.

deedee10
09-19-2007, 05:37 PM
Yep, I'm the first one to admit that I am a lazy bug. I don't want to exercise and I hate to watch how much and what I eat but I have to if I want to get down to my healthy weight and [act] like a mature adult. And boy, does it get harder as you get older......

jtammy
09-19-2007, 05:55 PM
Okay, how many times have I had someone say "I'd do anything to lose weight, how are you doing it?" As soon as I mention exercise and limiting food, I've lost their interest. Well, they'd do anything except that..... Where's the magic pill????

ennay
09-19-2007, 06:24 PM
All or nothing mentality. We have been trained to think we must suffer to lose weight. Virtually all of the diets have "BAD" foods and act like one iota of the bad food will derail you.

Which leaves us with the impression that to be thin we must never again eat foods we like and we must only eat foods we despise.

And that we must follow a prescribed diet to the letter or it is no good. I actually had someone tell me once that she couldnt do SBD because she didnt like V-8 and she was allergic to fish and in phase one she HAD to eat fish and V-8. :lol: And so there was no point in trying.

Oh and diet mentality anyway...its not a life change its just a diet and the more you suffer the more successful you will be....Its virtuous to suffer.

kaplods
09-19-2007, 06:52 PM
There are a lot of diet myths and assumptions that have become ingrained. There seems to be this impression that change has to be immediate, drastic, and complete to have any success at all. One must find a diet guru (in the form of a book, weight loss program in a magazine...) and follow their rules to the letter for the rest of time...

I must wake up tomorrow, eat 1100 calories (not 1101) of "diet" food (1100 calories of regular food won't work), run for an hour, drink 10 or more glasses of water (not 9.5, and not 8 glasses of water, and 2 glasses of milk....). If I don't lose weight 1 week, I have hit a "plateau."

It's "magical thinking," and the "diet industry" encourages it, because people trying to sell you stuff want to convince you that you can only lose weight with their product or service.

JayEll
09-19-2007, 07:14 PM
Right on, kaplods! You GO! :broc: :broc:

Jay

IrishRover
09-19-2007, 07:16 PM
the weird thing though, is that even though everyone is always talking about weight loss and diets and blah blah blaaah, i know very few people on "diets" who know the first thing about nutrition! for example my best friend (a primary school teacher) thinks that chewing gum makes you fat because you breathe more when youre chewing and so you gain weight from the air...:?: or theres my boyfriends mother who is significantly over weight and is always going on about how she "HAS" to lose weight but then does literally not a thing about it! she goes out and spends loads of money on low fat crisps and yoghurts and low fat chocolate bars, and then eats 12 of them at once! why? because theyre low fat! she then proceeds to advise me (professional dieter using actual food, no chemicals allowed!) that bagels are a brilliant subsitute for bread because you can eat several of them and not gain weight! whats so bad about a bit of bread? and unless ive been misled, your average white bagel is a good few more calories and fat grams than 2 slices of wholewheat bread. its the fads and the marketing that are really messing up peoples knowledge of whats good for them and what isnt. vulnerable people who are trying to lose weight and dont really know how to go about it are being exploited on all sides, and i think its really very sad.

jillybean720
09-19-2007, 07:39 PM
And I totally don't get people who don't like vegetables at all! My friend's sister is like that. Like...how do you...function?
haha, I function very well, thank you very much! :D

I'm one of those people--to me, vegetables ARE the evil "diet" food. I can't stand most veggies (exceptions being the starchy ones--white potatoes and yellow corn). I used to like more veggies as a child that I can't stand now (example: I liked peas as a kid--can't stand them now!). I WISH I liked veggies--would make weight loss much easier as they are the one thing you can really eat a lot of for not a ton of calories (bar the starchy ones I love, of course). Every once in a while, I buy a whole bunch of fresh and frozen veggies thinking maybe my tastes have changed or maybe if I prepare them this one other way...but it never seems to work :dizzy:

EZMONEY
09-19-2007, 07:43 PM
Talk about not "getting it" what about the 2 people I know that ate whatever they wanted then...are ready for this?...drank a bottle of Slim Fast! after the meal....guess they thought the stuff in the bottle was little "food eater" creatures!

That makes as much sense as the college...YES! I said college! roommate my daughter had one year, she believed if you MOVED AROUND at the beach you WOULD NOT get a sunburn....both stories absolutely true!!

kaplods
09-19-2007, 08:35 PM
I remember when TCBY (a national frozen yogurt chain) served slim-fast shakes made with frozen yogurt. Um, not a whole lot better than making it with ice cream! Especially since I had a friend who didn't read the fine print, and thought they were the same 220 - 250 calories she was getting in her slimfast shake at home. They were closer to 400.

When I taught preschool health and nutrition (to preschool teachers, not preschoolers), I was astonished at the ignorance. The number of people who knew the difference between calories, fat, protein, and carbohydrate was suprisingly low, and I'm not talking about a high level distinction, but being able to answer a question on a test such as... Butter is primarily a. protein, b. fat, c. carbohydrate

And do you have any idea how many people think "Sun Chips" are a heatlh food?

srmb60
09-19-2007, 11:58 PM
Instant gratification ... yup. The easy route ... yup.

Why, do you think, do some of us do understand basic nutrition and some don't?

Let me see if I can put a nebulous thought into words ... We find a new gadget or weight loss method. Perhaps we hope it might work but a small part of us knows it's too good to be true. When it doesn't work ... it's not our fault that we're still as heavy as ever. We're not stupid. We knew it probably wouldn't work. We tried but the 'new thing' didn't work.
Is pre-absolved a word?

Amy8888
09-21-2007, 12:54 PM
I'm thinking of my mom when I say this. I think along the way she's tried some fat free foods and hated them. She now equates anything "healthy" or "reduced fat" with being evil and tasting horrible. She won't try the new reduced fat items that actually taste decent (IMO, like Light Done Right dressing, etc.). They've really come a long way in terms of that kind of diet food! Also, she scoffs at the fact that we actually eat turkey bacon. Now, for me, turkey bacon approximates what I sometimes crave in real bacon enough to satisfy me most of the time. But if I were serving it to others, I would go with the real stuff. And if I'm out to breakfast, I eat the real stuff. I just really don't mind making substitutions like that on a daily basis, whereas the thought of it completely offends my mom.

modkittn
09-21-2007, 01:16 PM
Why, do you think, do some of us do understand basic nutrition and some don't?

I was simply never taught it. Never once was nutrition taught in my elementary, middle, or high school gym class (which is apparently where it is taught in some schools now). The college I went to didn't have a gym or nutritional class requirement. I learned on my own when I was a teenager because I was about 30-40 pounds overweight and wanted to know how to lose it.

junebug41
09-21-2007, 01:24 PM
WE ARE SPOILED ~ WE WANT IT and WE WANT IT NOW :tantrum:

This reminds me of that comedian (can't think of his name! argh!) who said:

"You know what the baby boomer slogan is, right? 'Give me that it's MINE!' "

Not singling out the boomers for this, but it is a bit indicative of a society that's gone a bit mad with entitlement. You are on to something, Gary!

K8-EEE
09-21-2007, 04:23 PM
I went to a really inspiring talk given by a nutritionist....she said that one of the biggest myths among her college aged clients is that when they are having a venti chocolate chip frappaccino it's "just a coffee....."

She says: this is not "a coffee", it's a hot fudge sundae in a glass, often taken with a GIANT muffin that is the size of three muffins -- she sez she's known young girls who were mystified at their weight gain drop 15 pounds just by stopping the Starbucks and Jumba Juice habit.

K8-EEE
09-21-2007, 04:25 PM
Hey my cousin is an ER doctor and he admits that until recent health issues caused him to do some research, he knew close to nothing about nutrition. He went to Med School in the 70s and said the nutrition he remembers covering was like, the Food Pyramid on the cereal box!