Anyone with knee problems?

[DonnaP1210]

This is my first post to the boards. I've been just kind of lurking and amazed by the support and kind words everyone has for others. I've been having a lot of knee pain (both knees but the right one is worse) and I was told that it was probably arthritis. I've tried the injections but they didn't help. (The cordizone worked for about 2 weeks). Well, after x-rays, I got the word today that it is arthritis and it is "moderatly, severe" and since they have tried all they can try the only thing left is knee replacement. The doctor doesn't want to do that yet because of my age (59) and other factors (I think because of my weight which is 270 lbs.) My question is, has anyone had knee problems, lost weight and had less pain? I'm trying to follow the WW123 plan (not going to meetings but doing it on my own) but really need to really get serious with it because I can't live with this pain every day. I work full time and also a caregiver for my husband who had a stroke almost 5 years ago. I think I need to hear that if I got this extra weight off, I'd be pain free. (Wouldn't that be an answer to prayer?) Thanks for listening, I just feel a little bummed right now.

Donna

[Happy Canuk]

Hi Donna. I don't know about the pain - whether or not it would stop. I have arthritis in my back, and it doesn't make any difference at all, whether I am slim or not. In fact, sometimes, I think it hurts worse when I lose weight - but I never give up trying. My son-in-laws father was 410 pounds and had his stomach stapled. He was a security guard and did lots of walking. I guess the pain really subsided in his knees when he lost weight. The pain I have in my knees is also arthritis, but also Fibromyalgia and a lot of it is caused from the lower back, so who knows. I just think we would all feel better, being a few pounds less - maybe not pain wise, but certainly more confident etc. Hope you get better. Did your Dr. tell you to start taking Glucosomine? That CAN help rebuild cartlege apparently. Worth a try.

[MemeToo]

Donna, I've had surgery on both knees and yes, losing weight DOES help the pain! I got up over 200 a few years back and just losing down in the 170s has helped. So...if you need incentive to lose, the knee pain should be enough!!! Sorry...I can't tell you it goes away completely because it never will. It will still be bad when you have been on your feet a lot and it will still be bad when it is going to rain or snow, etc. But losing weight makes it more bareable so, I feel it is worth doing! I'm 54 and they won't do replacement surgery on me either. Said I would have to have it done over again several times (if I live long enough)! :eek:

MEME

[DonnaP1210]

Happy Canuk and Meme, thank you both for your reply. Even though I know in my heart I would be better off all the way around if I lost weight, I'm trying to get it in my head. I've been really trying to stick to the program. When I start to crave something all I have to do is think that it will take that much longer before this weight gets off. I want to start feeling better as soon as possible.

Happy - The Dr. did tell me about Glucosomine and I started taking it. (the money I save on food should take care of the cost of the Glucosomine since it's not covered by my insurance). Thanks

Meme - what kind of surgery did you have on your knees? Thanks for the words, "losing weight does help the pain". I needed that.

Donna

[Carnation]

Yes, losing weight does help the pain and I'm living proof of that!!! I have degenerative arthritis in most of my joints confirmed by a zillion tests and x-rays. I've gone from 240 to 190 and feel l00% better!!!
Also, I askd my orthopaedic surgeon about glucosomine and chondroitin and he said that it wouldn't help but also wouldn't hurt and if I wanted to waste my money to go ahead. Well, I tried a combination capsule and nearly instantly felt better. If it is a placebo effect I'll take it anyway!!! I'm able to walk now and actually feel alive for a change. Hope this helped some.. Carleen....

[DonnaP1210]

Carnation - Thank you for your reply. I really needed to hear this today. This pain is wearing me out, physically and emotionally! Thank you for your words of hope. As a reminder, I am going to print your reply and put it next to my computer.

[Neve]

Donna,
I know just how you feel about the knee pain.I have osteoarthritis in both knees the left is so bad the Dr said he would do a knee replacement but it would have to be redone in about 8 years.The pain is so bad some days I can hardly move.I also have fibromyliga and am about 130 lbs overweight.I just wont to let you know you're not alone.It's not easy. Good luck and hang in there. Neve,

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[DonnaP1210]

Neve, thank you for understanding. I am not usually a complainer but some days it really gets to me. . . being in pain all the time that I am on my feet. With the Lord's help I am doing pretty good sticking to the WW123 program. My only hope right now is to get this extra weight off and be able to function better some day. We have about the same amount of weight to lose. We should support each other though this journey. Wishing you well, Donna.

[LightandLace]

Would someone please try to describe the knee pain? I have had a pain in the back of my knee for about 9 months now. My first concern is that it could be a blood clot-but I don't have any of the other symtoms that usually accompany those. The Dr. mentioned a torn ligament -she was guessing-but could it hurt for this long??? ANy thoughts would be welcome! Thanks, Karen

[christineu]

I am not sure any of you are checking this thread- it has been awhile since any one posted. I have been a poster here at 3FC for over a year now. During that time I have had 3 open knee surgeries for my severe kneecap arthritis and a chronically ruptured muscle that since its repair has developed more pain from neuromas. I have ongoing, high levels of pain that require long term narcotic pain medication just to walk- and to stop my kneecap from dislocating. I feel like my life revolves around seeing numerous doctors (7 or 8 orthos last year though only 3 were part of my treatment team). Overall, I have had 5 surgeries on my left knee, 2 on my right- all open surgeries except the very first one I had (though most of my surgeries were multiple procedures and included both arthroscopes and open procedures). My first 3 surgeries were in 1988-9 though 4 of the surgeries have been since 1999 (1 right, 3 left).

One word of warning- I was on anti-imflamatories- I had ot use the newer ones (Vioxx, Mobic) and I nver realized until I went off the VIoxx after 18 months on it that it was causing me to retain water. I was on Mobic for 6 weeks or so and even when I went off that (stomach problems) that I had less swelling withOUT it- for the first time since my surgery last May, I can finally see the bump in the shin that the doctor made to realign my kneecap. Looking back over the past 11 years since I graduated from high school every time I gained a lot of weight was when I was on anti-immflamtories (advil/motrin, orudis, naprosyn, daypro- you name it, I probably was on it)- I could not stay on them longer then a year or so due to stomach distress. Now I am 29 and can longer take anti-imflamatories for more the 10 days- 2 weeks max without irritating my stomach and I am on daily ulcer medication.

I do use a cane or fore arm crutch to walk- without it I would not get very far without higher levels of pain. I also find that it lets others know that I can move fast (and keeps the little old ladies at the stores from running me over with their cart ;) )I am severely limited in what I can do for exercise- basically using a recumbant exercise bike is my main cardio. I also use a pilates, though I have to modify parts of the routine; my knee exercises, and hand weights for my arm/upper body while I am on the bike. I also use a TENS unit at home for pain, icing, relaxation/meditation to help with pain. I am limited to desk work only, no stairs, no kneeling, no squating. When I asked my phsycial therapist about ever being able to walk for fitness again he told me I was stuborn enough that he knows I could go out and walk/light hike somewear but that he was more worried about me getting back.

I have, in the past year or so, lost nearly 50 pounds even with all the surgeries and rehab. I can't say my pain is any less wiht the weight loss, but I know it can't hurt. I am really frustrated that for so many years my knee problems where ignored- I heard the "you have knee pain because you are overweight" more times then I care to remember when the entire time I had a ruptured muscle that was allowing my kneecap to partially dislocate and wore most of the cartilage off the back of it.

Christine

[Greeneyez]

I haven't read all the replies cause there were soooo many of them so if I'm repeating something someone else said, sorry about that.
I have no cartilage in my right knee and little left in my left knee. It's due to arthritis & weight. I started using this...Glucosamine Hcl (500) & Chondroitin (400) [combined together] and am amazed at the relief I have. I have since heard and am now doing it..that you should take one pill for every 50 lbs you weigh. So instead of the 3 daily they recommend, I take 7....you can find them at any health store and Advil makes them tooo but charges bookoos for it. Swansonvitamins.com has a good price on them. I tried it with Shark's Cartilage added but didn't get the same relief. This mineral (which is naturally in your body but not high doses) actually begins to repair the damage to the cartilage. It's best not to run out for long periods of time cause the process has to then start all over again. I hope this helps you. Nothing's like that knee pain and being unable to walk.

[DonnaP1210]

Greeneyez - Yes, someone did tell me about the Glucosamine/Chondroitin capsules but I didn't know about the 1 capsule per 50 lbs. Thank you so much for giving this information. I've been taking 3 a day for about a month but I should be taking 5 or 6. I'll start taking 6 today. Do you take them all at once or do you spread them out during the day? How long have you been taking them? I sure hope this stuff helps me because the from the way the doctor sounds, there isn't anything else he can do short of a knee replacement but he doesn't want to do that yet. I think because of my age and my weight. Thanks again, Donna.

[Carnation]

My orthopaedist told me that as far as he was concerned, Glucosamine and Chondroitin are just a waste of money and if I wanted to waste money to just go ahead and take them. He felt that it wouldn't hurt me but also would not do any good. Well, since I was desparate to stop some of my arthritis pain, I tried them and I have had really great results. I just follow the recommended dosage on the bottle. The neatest thing is that the current issue of the Arthritis Today magazine (put out by the Arthritis Foundation) quotes a new study that found that it DOES help and is documented!!! I was ready to accept the placebo effect (I'll take relief anytime even if it was just psychological!) but now I know that my relief is REAL. If you have arthritis and want to know more about it and related diseases, it would help you to subscribe to Arthritis Today - you can trust the info as being factual and up to date!!! Hope this helps...Carleen...

[Greeneyez]

Donna....I take 2 at a time...3 X a day. The one per 50 lbs. was told to a friend by a doctor. The bottle itself won't tell you anything cause of the food and drug laws. If they did, they'd be administering medicine and thats a no no...grrrr
They wanted to replace my kneecaps too but said cause of the weight, the new knees would break down sooner than the 10 yr. lifespan of knee replacement. And I'm too young even for the 10 yrs even if I didn't have the extra weight. (I'm 54 now)....and he said second replacements are never as successful as the first surgery.....needless to say I had to find something cause surgery was out!!! I'm very happy with the supplements I am taking.

[Spunky Granny]

I too have knee problems and plan to lose weight and see if that helps.

I am only 52 so they say no surgery would have to have it redone too many times before the good Lord takes me away

I have been taking Slim Fast for about 2 weeks so far. I drink a can in the morning at AM then again around 11 AM for supper I eat a regular meal Unfortunately, I sit at a desk all day. I have not lost any weight yet but I do feel better -- must be the vitamins in Slim Fast I get no exercise hate exercise too hard on the knees It is hell to get old!!

This is my first time at this site but I have gotten several good suggestions for getting this weight off I am going to be a Granny in October again and my one year old grandson is wearing me out FAST

GOT TO LOSE WEIGHT

[DonnaP1210]

Spunky Granny - Is your knee problem due to arthritis? I've gotten a lot of advise from the people on this message board. They have really been helpful. They have given me hope that I will feel better in time. I started taking Glucosamine/Chondroitin supplement and since I've increased taking them to 6 times a day instead of 3 times a day (because of Greeneyez's suggestion) I have notice a little relief. I take 6 a day faithfully, even though they are big horse pills. Carleen wrote that she is living proof that weight loss will help relieve some of the pain. I need constant reminders that there is hope and I've printed Carleen's reply and put it next to my computer here at work. It helps me stay more focused on sticking to the program. (I'm on the WW123, but doing it myself - not going to the meetings.) I too, sit at desk all day and don't get much exercise because of my knees. I've heard that a stationery bike is good exercise for arthritic knees. I have one but it is in the basement and I've been putting it off because of having to go down the stairs but I really need to make myself do it. I noticed you are from Illinois. So am I. I live about 30 miles from Chicago. Where are you from? Congratulations on becomming a Grandma again. I have two granddaughters, 9 & 11 years old. They are a joy. Better get back to work. Thanks for the reply.

Donna

[Spunky Granny]

DonnaP1210

I would have answered you sooner but my server was down.

I am from the Peoria area. I work for a school bus contractor. Where do you work?

I also HAD a bike but MY knees wouldn't take the abuse. I can do my walking but it is no fun when you walk alone. Right now my husband is working 12 hour days so he can't walk with me after work.

I haven't tried any of the pills but my husband is taking them for his knees. So far he hasn't mentioned any success.

What is WW123?

Thanks for sending the thread

[DonnaP1210]

Spunky Granny -

Sorry it took so long to answer. I'm at work and have been busy, busy, busy. I'm a secretary at a pharmaceutical company north of Chicago.

How long has your husband been taking the Glucosamine capules? You ought to try them and see if they help.

I like your name, "Spunky Granny". I felt "spunky" before this knee problem, now I feel like an "old granny"!!

WW123 is Weight Watchers. You count points instead of calories. Each food has a point value and you get a certain amount of points per day. I think it's the best program out there.

Take care.


Donna

[The_Generals_Mom]

I, too, have recently been diagnosed with arthritis in my knee. I have been taking Glucosamine Chondroitin for the last 3 weeks. I have also been receiving injections of Sinvisc from the orthepedic doc. This replaces the synvonic fluid around the knee and should eliminate the pain for about a year. Although the fullest effect of these injections comes at about 8 weeks, my knee pain is markedly diminished starting with this week. I have been able to start exercising again at Curves. You might want to ask your doc about Sinvisc. It seems to be working for me.

[debrarae]

I have chrondomalysia in both of my knees. Before I had knee problems I 'thought' that I knew what pain was (after all I did have two kids all natural). I soon found out what real pain was. I tried to 'work' through it but I soon found out that could not happen. A over the counter supplement was recommended to me called Osteobiflex. within a month I could walk a mile without too much pain. The stuff tastes horrible. This stuff tastes so bad that I have to drink two cups of Sanka decaf coffee just to wash it down but it works. I heard that they have a brand of osteobiflex with sulfa in it for people with arthritis. Since I can't take sulfa I have'nt tried it. By the way getting back on the subject; I can walk 4 miles every couple of days now with no pain. I can do arobics and work out on the weights. According to my doctor I should be at my goal weights in a couple of years as I have a slo-w-w-wwww metablism. Good luck to you. My prayers are with you.

[DonnaP1210]

To The Generals Mom and debrarae. . .

The Generals Mom - Thank you for your reply. I did have the Sinvisc injections in both knees a couple months ago. They didn't work for me. My doctor said they work very well on 1/3 of the patients, some relief on 1/3 and no relief on 1/3. You are very lucky it is helping. It's kind of weird but when I got the last injection, that afternoon my right knee got worse. (I was actually having more pain in the left knee when I started going to the doctor.) I asked the doctor if it was from the injection and he said he didn't think so. (he said he never had that complaint from anyone else). He said he's tried everything he could short of knee replacement but doesn't want to do that at this time. I 'm just hoping I can get relief from the Glucosamine/Chondroitin capsuls I take plus Celebrex and Advil. (I hate taking medication but I've got to do something.) Of course I need to lose weight which
I'm sure would help take some pressure off. Thanks again and I hope you continue getting better.

debrarae - What is chrondomalysia? Thank you for the information on Osteobiflex. I am going to look for it this weekend. I am the point that I will try anything, hoping one of them will relieve this pain. I am so glad this help you. I look forward to walking with no pain. Thank you for your prayers and words of hope.

Donna

[Greeneyez]

Hi all....

I haven't been here in awhile but sure got a bunch of info reading the last two pages of this thread :o)

I have to repeat the question...what in the world is chrondomalysia?

I'll try that nasty tasting stuff you mentioned too hahahha...of course you already have me NOT looking forward to taking it.

I'm with you on the meetings. There aren't any convenient here to go to WW's so I have to just take things by ear (meaning the forums ) I have an awful lot of weight to lose and I knowwww it's half of my knee pain. If you can't stand for more than 2-3 minutes without pain shooting through your legs and back then something's got to go...and I prefer it wasn't ME :)

I'm sorry I can't remember all the names of y'all but nothing is below this window like there used to be (so you could scroll down when you forgot someone's name or something they said)

[christineu]

Greeneyez-

Chodromalcia is softening of the cartilage on the back of the kneecap- some doctor use it for any kneecap pain as a diagnosis but it can only actually be diagnosed officially by visualization during a surgery or on some MRI's. Just about everyone over 30-35 has it to some degree and most people have no symptoms with it. A lot of kneecap problems are from the kneecap not tracking properly- most cases respond to doing physical therapy exercises and other conservative treatments- shoe inserts, medication, taping, bracing, activity modification- about 85% do well with those types of treatment. I was in the 15% that needed surgical intervention as a teenager and had to have my kneecaps basically taken off and reattached- the patella tendon was moved over with a peice of bone, other mussles shorten while others were legthened on both of my knees. My left knee never was right after that- I had so many problems but none of my doctors took me seriously- they blamed it all my weight. Looking back now I know I gained weight becuase I was not active because of my knee and the anti-imflamatories have a strange reaction with me too that I tend to gain well I am on them- if I diet while taking them I can mantain but if I stop I gain weight. Of course it took my 12 years to figure this out though now due to stomach ulcers they caused I will never be on them long term again. My right knee is pretty good htough it also has had extensive surgeries and I have to continue to do exercises. My left knee is pretty much shot- I fall in the less then 1% of cases that no treatment will help with.

With my left knee come to find out I had ruptured one of the muscles the surgeon had shortened- this was discovered until I had surgery 12 years later- lucky for me I had been referred to the top surgeon in the world for kneecap problems. A few surgeries later and I still have a lot of pain- both from severe arthritis of the kneecap and residual damage to the muscle that had been ruptured. So at the age of 29 I get to look forward to using a cane for the rest of my life, taking pain medication, using whatever herbal meds I can to help with the arthritis/joint pain and figuring out how I am going to do all the things I should be enjoying at this point in my life. As far as exercise I am pretty limited. I have set up an upper body cycle so I have something I can do all the time. I am allowed to use a Nordic Track but I broke my foot so I have to wait a few weeks to try it. I can also use an elliptical trainer some- I have ot limit it to a few times per month along with the pool- I went yesterday and I am still having partial kneecap dislocation when I try to kick. I have also been told to limit my time on my exercise bike- every time I peddle around I have more pain so I never can get enough of a work out on it to make it worth my time.

A great site for knee problems on line is www.kneeguru.co.uk -they have a lot of information and a great forum with a lot of different types of people with all sorts of knee problems from all over the world. You might want to check it out some time.

I am still doing WW at home- with having had 3 surgeries, 2 broken feet and working on my PhD I do not have the time or the money to go to meeting for the past 1 1/2 years. I do meet with a nutritionist at the university from time to time to just keep myself in check. I have lost about 40-45 pounds in the last year or so- pretty good considering all the time I have been laid up. I do take some supplements that I have found to help- Glucosamin & Chondrotin, evening primrose oil, calcium with Vit D & Magnesium. I have just added SAM-e to see if I notice a difference with it. I am also on long term pain management medication just to walk- otherwise I would not even be able to walk more then in my house. I do still do formal physical therapy and am diligent about doing my home exercises. I also use a TENS unit a few times per week, use ice 2-3 times per day, and an homeopathic ointment on it along with limiting my activities (avoid stairs, no squating, kneeling, crawling, desk work only, etc) and using a single fore arm crutch for walking (though right now I am on crutches until my foot heals- I broke when I fell from a partial kneecap dislocation a few weeks ago- I have several partial dislocation per day though I usually do not fall when I have one thankfully).

I agree that losing weight is good for our overall health but since I have so little damage to the rest of my knee joint my knees have not taken much abuse from my weight surprisingly. It is important to stay as healthy as possible as we lose our weight and make sure the exercises we choice are apropriate for our individual knees.

Christine