[Idealmuse]

Hi guys -

I wasn't sure where to post this so feel free to move it if you like. I just heard about a new book coming out next month that sounds interesting. "Good Calories, Bad Calories"

It sounds like it meshes with what a lot of us have come to believe on our own through trial and error about "bad" carbs. I know that this shift in thinking personally has been a key to what I feel is going to be my soon to be success. Gosh and it only took about a couple dozen tries to get it right.

I just preordered it from Amazon. I'll let you know if it's interesting at all. It might be good material for the book overviews that the maintainers do (I enjoy reading those!) if it ends up being any good.

-muse

[JayEll]

And here's how you can help 3FC with all your book orders--if you don't already know.

Originally Posted by Meg

If you shop at Amazon.com. you can give a little bit back to 3FC - at no cost to you! Simply click on the 'Store' button on the far right side of the purple menu bar on the top of this page (the 3FC forum page). There's also a 'Store' button on the far right of the purple bar on the Home Page. When you click it, you go to a 3FC store there or you can go directly to Amazon.com from the link on that page and buy any of their products. A portion of your purchase price comes back to 3FC but doesn't increase your price at all. What a great deal!

Remember, you have to access Amazon through the 'Store' link in order to benefit 3FC.

Jay

[Suzanne 3FC]

Thanks for the plug, Jay

I'm curious about this book. The author is the one that wrote the article a few years ago promoting low carb diets, titled "What if it was all a big fat lie". You probably heard about it, it was all over the news for at least a year, quoted often, but rarely dissected. As it turned out, and this didn't make the news, the article was filled with false information, and should never have been published. More details can be found at http://www.reason.com/news/show/28714.html

Given what happened then, I would be hesitant to purchase his new book.

[Idealmuse]

Thanks Suz - I had read the article but not the one you posted... I'm off to go read that now.

Maybe I should just get it from the library instead?

[Idealmuse]

Thanks again Suz... Okay I just read it... and the reply to the debunking article and what can I say my head is spinning. If they wanted me confused it worked!

I guess I took his original article with more of a grain of salt... Normally someone says Atkins and I pretty much start tuning out because it's not a substainable way of eating for me, but I did really identify with eliminating the "empty" carbs and how it makes your cravings go away and your hunger level lower and the whole blood sugar / insulin thing was starting to click with me. I guess need to research more of that.

I didn't read the original article and say hey I'm going to eat a pound of bacon now! I have cut back on the empty carbs and in turn raised my healthy fats a bit (I was really low before maybe 10-15 percent) and protein and I've seen positive effects from it. I think extremes of any sort really are a big warning sign.

Anyway with the question of his possibly twisting the facts I'm not sure I want to outright purchase the book without seeing it, so I'm going to cancel my pre-order and look it over at the book store. I definatly don't want to support an author who is manipulating the facts...

So I thank you for posting that URL... this is why 3fc rocks.

-muse

[JayEll]

JayEll <------ Thinking about eating a pound of bacon...



Jay

[Idealmuse]

Someone mentioned on Myfooddiary this book is out now.

I did cancel my pre-order so if someone picks it up can you let us know what you think? I want to look it over before I decide. While some things this guy says really clicks with my experience (insulin etc) some of the things he says seem to be off the wall.

-muse

[miradoblackwarrior]

Hey, all--
Just got the library copy and started to read it. It is DENSE! Lots and lots of words in tiny, tiny script. A real eye-crosser!

In a nutshell, if you're interested, it says, "Atkins good, everything else bad." As a former (and soon to be again) Atkins dieter, there really wasn't anything to add to that. I got through the forward and scanned some of the pages. Same message. Not sure if I have the courage to plow through it all. Yikes!

Susan

[Idealmuse]

Thanks Mira -

See its that all or none mentality that bothers me. Most of us do better somewhere in the middle.

I've actually cut back my carbs a lot so i understand the benefit, but I still eat much more carbs then Atkins... and I just can't understand a world where a bowl of fiber one with skim milk and strawberries = BAD.

[Ready2ShedLBS]

What I dont understand about Atkins, is that you cut carbs. All carbs. Just like not all calories are created equal, not all carbs are created equal. This is just my opinion, but there is seriously something wrong when I am told to cut back on fruits and veggies and eat more meat and cheese which is high in saturated fat. I dont get it

[Suzanne 3FC]

I'm 45 and I'm thinking about antioxidants and fiber, neither of which are found in protein and fat. The vegetable choices and small amounts permitted on many low carb diets can't provide my body with what it needs based on my personal health goals. If your goal is just weight loss, then I guess it doesn't matter what diet you follow since they all can do that.

Regarding the book above, I did buy and wish I'd returned it. Gina Kolata, a well known expert, wrote an excellent review for the New York Times at http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/07/bo...in&oref=slogin

Kolata appears to be familiar with Taubes's history of distorting the facts and her review reflects this.

My impression is that Kolata is saying Taubes mainly claims that there's a lack of evidence (that he wants to quote) to prove a high fat, high protein, high sodium, low fiber diet can result in health issues, therefore there's no reason to believe it.

I get the impression Taubes has repeated some of his earlier tactics which may include misquoting experts.

He also says he interviewed more than 600 doctors, researchers and administrators, though he adds that “the appearance of their names in the text ... does not imply that they agree with all or even part of the thesis set forth in this book.”

This statement in particular struck me...

But the problem with a book like this one, which goes on and on in great detail about experiments new and old in areas ranging from heart disease to cancer to diabetes, is that it can be hard to know what has been left out.

He previously left out documented studies that proved the dangers of a high fat, high protein diet. He was slammed for picking and choosing specific studies, and for leaving out anything that could have provided a more balanced opinion. Perhaps he's done the same thing here.

[mrainy]

I listened to a November 2nd Talk of The Nation interview with Gary Taubes, the author of the book, and Dr. Ronald Krauss, Senior scientist and director of Atherosclerosis research at the Children's Hospital Oakland Research Institute.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=15886898

I haven't read the book, just listened to the interview. It sounds like Taubes isn't particularly interested in the ability of people to keep the weight off long term, or long term health effects. He's more interested in the mechanism of weight loss, and determining how people become obese.

They tried to bring in a little discussion of the type of carbohydrates, simple vs. complex. The interview was interesting.

Rainy

[kaplods]

I think that someone who criticizes current wisdom as being based on too little evidence, and then ignores all evidence that doesn't fit his theory, is not someone you want to take advice from.

If you know that he has not been entirely truthful in the past, no matter how interesting or even true the information in this new book might seem (or even be), the bottom line is that you can't trust it.

[suechef]

I'm going to step in here for a second. First, the book doesn't boil down to "Atkins good, everything else bad". It's far more complex than that. A large portion of it is about heart disease and other "western" diseases. He also doesn't say carbs are bad. He talks a lot about how metabolic processes work and how they may function differently in overweight people, and a lot of what he says just makes sense.

Second, I can say as a former freelance writer who worked on some contentious issues, that when he says He also says he interviewed more than 600 doctors, researchers and administrators, though he adds that “the appearance of their names in the text ... does not imply that they agree with all or even part of the thesis set forth in this book.”, that's a good thing. He is bringing a lot of information together, and some of the people he spoke to found certain things in their science, which he reported, but it's very fair for him to point out that while they said what they said, they may not agree with his conclusions. Two parties can look at a set of facts and draw dramatically different conclusions.

Re. leaving stuff out - everyone leaves stuff out, including the people we normally turn to for information. Reading his responses to his critics is important, because a large part of what he is saying is that a lot of the conventional wisdom is based on some interesting decisions by some parties to use study data very selectively in the past - he provides that information very clearly in the book.

I'm not saying he's right about everything - although he might be! - but it's worth remembering that in science whenever someone comes along who challenges the status quo a lot of people get very upset. Remember Galileo! It's also worth remembering that people overwhelmingly believe that which fits with what they already believe. Take global warming - if you don't really believe in it, you can have 100 Nobel winning scientists saying it's true, but you're going to believe the one guy who comes out and says those guys are all crazy leftists trying to ruin the world as we know it, because it fits your comfort level.

My recommendation - read the book and make up your own mind, don't let someone else do it for you!

cheerio,
Sue

[ckatgo]

I saw this guy on a Larry King interview with Andrew Weil, Mehmet OZ, and Julian Micheals. He tried to convince the panel that high carb diet lead to lack of exercise and wieght gain. Not that lack of excercise lead to weight gain and that people sat around due to a high carb diet. Not a lack of exercise lead to weight gain.


I was rolling on the floor laughing, needless to say I don't plan on reading the book.

But, to be fair, it is good to question.