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OT - gallstones (opinoin)

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Old 02-08-2008, 02:42 PM   #1
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Default OT - gallstones (opinoin)

Hi folks...an ultra sound has shown that I have gallstones. They are thinking that's why I have had continual back pain since mid December. I am going to also check with my orthopedist to see about back stuff - because I don't have other symptoms for gall bladder disease.

I have a friend who sent me this natural way to flush out gallstones. Have any of you ever heard of this. I saw a few things like it on the web...but, actually now know someone who did it successfully.

My first reaction is no. If it were this easy doctors would tell you to do it. My next reaction is that doctors don't often believe in this type of medicine- it's a business, too. Surgeons do surgery to make a living.

From my friend.... what do you think.

(BTW - it's just your opinion - don't worry about what you say.)

<<<Hi, Beverly

I went to the health food store and bought two bottles of ultra-phos, (sometimes it's called ortho-phos, and they're the same thing.) You put half the bottle in a quart of apple juice, and drink that throughout the day. You do that for three days. If for some reason you can't drink apple juice, then distilled water will work, but apple juice does work better. You'll have half a bottle of ultra phos left over, but keep it in case you decide to do a follow up treatment in a month or so. Also, you can eat-it's not a fast. a
At the end of the third day, or the beginning of the fourth day, take a cup of olive oil (the lighter, the better) and a cup of coke classic (not a whole can) and mix them. Add the juice of two fresh lemons. drink it. (It really is NOT as bad as it sounds. I kept pouring that mixture between two cups to keep it mixed. Then as soon as I had it all down, I stuck a wedge of lemon in my mouth to cut the oily taste.) Then go lay down on your right side for half an hour. After that you can go do whatever you want.

It took until the next day for this to work for me, both times that I've done it. You won't necessarily have diarrhea, but you will have to go pretty urgently.

How this works is really pretty simple. The ultra phos softens the stones. That's why it's important to drink it for three full days. Then when you drink the olive oil mixture and lay down, your liver doesn't know what to do with it so it spasms, (which doesn't hurt) and it shoots out all the softened stones. I've done it twice and didn't feel any pain either time. I could feel some twitches around where my liver is, but that's it. I've known a lot of people who have used this remedy, and none of them said it hurt, either. Some of them said that they passed gall stones the size of ping pong balls, too. Mine were about the size of marbles.


Also, if you drink plain apple juice every day, it helps. It makes it harder for gall stones to form in the first place. >>>>
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Old 02-08-2008, 03:38 PM   #2
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I've never heard of this before, but my thought on it is that it can't hurt, can it?

If I were in your situation, I think I'd much rather at least TRY this method than just giving up and facing surgery head-on. Of course, I am also terrified of surgery, so that might be part of it.

If you think it's worth giving a shot, then I say go for it! It doesn't seem like it could do too much harm, but I'm by no means a medical professional.

EDIT: Ok, so maybe it's not so harmless after all. Talk to your doctor first before you attempt anything, for sure.

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Old 02-08-2008, 04:17 PM   #3
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One of my dad's friends passed theirs that way, but I would consult a doctor first. I recently (last month) had my gallbladder taken out and they said for people to pass stones can be dangerous because depending on their size they can get stuck and cause worse problems. This was my mom's case, one of hers left her gallbladder and got stuck in her appendix, so she not only had to have her gallbladder out, but also her appendix. Gall stones are not like kidney stones, they are not really meant to be passed. If you are not having all of the symptoms then it might be OK to just leave them alone, but back pain is one of the symptoms. Mine were terrible though, I had nausea, back pain, heartburn that killed, etc...Personally, if this stuff isn't approved by doctors or the FDA I would advise against it.

Some online info:

Description of the meds
http://www.theherbfinder.com/products/ortho.html

http://www.manylevels.com/liverflush.htm

*It seems to me it depends on the severity of your gallstones.

Doctors responses on passing gall stones:
http://www.medicinenet.com/18499

http://csmc.edu/5344.html

http://yourtotalhealth.ivillage.com/...allstones.html

*It looks like the doctors are saying that they shouldn't be passed. I would definately stress talking to a doctor before trying this.
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Old 02-08-2008, 04:28 PM   #4
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I don't normally post in this forum (I use to a lot then limited where I was going becuase I didn't have time) anyways I saw this gallbadder topic as the most recent and thought I would reply.

In Nov 2006 I went to the hospital with the worst pain in my life and a large mass on my side. Immediate diagonis gallstones (pretty advanced) they gave me less then a weeks worth of pain pills to force me to go to the surgeon in less then a week. Went to the surgeon and got told that I had no choice but surgery while waiting to schedule the surgery I ended up back in the hospital (exactly a week since my first trip there) becuase of pain. The gallstones had moved into the bile path and blocked my liver. That means lots of pain, infection, and eventually my liver started to shut down. So during the 6 days I spent in the hospital (for what should have been an outpatient sugery) I had to have an ERCP to get my liver working and then having my gallbadder removed.

Why am I telling you this? One to let you know of the potential danger of trying to pass gallstones, they can do a lot of damage. I think the one in my bile tract was like 5 mm. I researched these gallbladder flushes because someone told me about them right after my first appointment, when the "stones" that you pass have been analysed they are mainly the oil you are drinking and not gallstones. There is a lot online if you search gallbladder or liver flush (gallstones are actually created by your liver). I would suggest following the low fat diet that your doctor should have recommened.

If you have any qustions PM me.
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Old 02-08-2008, 04:49 PM   #5
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Gall bladder removal is not a difficult surgery in most cases these days, as long as the stones have not migrated into the bile duct. If you use that cleansing method, I agree that you could end up with a bigger problem than you have now, and it is not easy to deal with it.

The time to avoid gall stones is before they form. Of course, most people don't know whether they have them or not until someone does an ultrasound.

The other things is, you could do that whole cleansing and still have gall stones. Then where would you be except where you started?

I no longer have my gallbladder, having had an acute attack after some minor pain for years. I never had any other symptoms. The acute attack was undeniably something really wrong, and I had surgery pretty quickly. I was up and home the next day. The gallstone I had was almost an inch in diameter--there was no way it would have left on its own.

Please don't do anything as drastic as what your friend has recommended without consulting your doctor.

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Old 02-08-2008, 05:16 PM   #6
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I appreciate your input everyone, my first instinct is not to do this. However, I'll run it by my doctor and see what she says. I think I already know the answer!

Thanks.
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Old 02-08-2008, 06:22 PM   #7
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Beverly Joy - I am usually the first one to suggest the alternative route (i.e. herbal, naturopathic) and usually do so myself, but in this situation I have been there and done that and I really hope you follow your gut instinct to NOT try and force them through yourself. Like, Remember How To Smile, I also had stones lodged in my bile duct, but mine were there because I was trying to pass them myself. Long story short I ended up with Pancreatitis which can be very, very dangerous and my liver function was out of wack too. Needless to say when they checked me out in the ER and got the test results they were very excited and I was into surgery that day to have my gallbladder removed. It was a simple procedure done laproscopicly (sp?) and I have tiny little scars that go very nicely with all the other tiny little scars on my tummy (c-section, stretch marks... ). Go to the surgery, take some time off. You will feel soooo much better after having it removed! No more middle of the night nausea and pain!

Good luck!
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Old 02-08-2008, 07:24 PM   #8
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My Mum also had a dislodged gallstone block her bile duct and the doctors had to deal with acute Jaundice as well as gallbladder removal. Although she recovered well she still has liver problems.

Trying to pass the stones does not seem a good idea to me.

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Old 02-08-2008, 08:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KforKitty View Post
My Mum also had a dislodged gallstone block her bile duct and the doctors had to deal with acute Jaundice as well as gallbladder removal.
My aunt's mom had the same problem. She actually turned *neon* yellow in the week before her surgery.

Quite frankly, I have enough problems without being a color not found in nature. I would opt not to try to pass the gallstone, if it were me.

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Old 02-08-2008, 11:33 PM   #10
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I was having pains for years, but just thought it meant I had made a bad food choice. Well, September 2006, I had a gallbladder attack in the middle of the night & would up in the ER @ 5am, right before the shifts changed over, so they were taking their sweet time in waiting on me. After a LONG time of waiting with no pain meds, they did ultrasound, found it was the gallbladder, and gave me a choice, meds until further notice or take it out. I said, take it out. They could not schedule me for surgery until 2 days later, and until then I laid around on Vicodin (gives me a headache) until the surgery. Laid around for 3 weeks afterward, dr's orders.

I had a gallstone stuck, so I would have been in pain until I had it out. The surgery itself was laparoscopic, and I'm so glad I had it done. I don't know about this email your friend sent you. Yes, I know surgeons are in business to make money, but really they are the ones with the medical degree & years of education behind that to back them up. I'm 99.7% sure they wouldn't have you undergo surgery if they thought you didn't need it. That's the thing with gallstones--you never know what they're gonna do!!! They's like the ninjas of the body.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
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Old 02-09-2008, 01:03 PM   #11
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Actually, I did a lot of research on this when the Cute Boyfriend had gallstones.

Here's the problems with the natural solution:
  1. The decision maker for me: they will still come back.
  2. There are people who flush them out naturally, and they get stuck and you have to do the emergency surgery which means a MUCH more extensive surgery with around 6 weeks of hospitalization.

CB had his surgery and he was up and around that day and eating normally that week.
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Old 02-09-2008, 10:30 PM   #12
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I had pain for eight months, the doctors never figured it out. One night I had excruciating pain, a gallstone was totally blocking my bile duct and my liver was spasming. Long story short, had the gallbladder removed the "old" way, with a large incision. Felt instantly better. Today of course they remove it laparoscopically, and everybody I know that had it done that way said it was nothing, you're up and almost normal in about three days. I would not mess around trying to do it yourself, if that really worked why would anybody need surgery?

Trust me, you'll be glad to be rid of those stones!
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